Chapter 3 New Combat is terrible

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On a side note regarding all the speculation towards the reason behind the control changes…

I think a lot of you are thinking of this change the wrong way… I don’t think this is in any way aimed at the controls themselves… they weren’t trying to change how the character handles… or “dumb it down” to somehow match consoles.

(…or any of the even wilder speculations that they’re trying to merge servers between PC and consoles which simply isn’t a thing they can do atm so it was never on the table)

No, I’m pretty sure the effects of this on the controls aren’t the intentional change… but the side-effect.

The intentional change was to prevent the character from rotating… more specifically to prevent them from rotating between individual hits of a combo chain… and… I am pretty sure it wasn’t primarily aimed against players to begin with (it applied to NPCs alike, which is why you had them in the past do an instant 180 between 2 hits of the same combo)
So most likely the goal here was to simply force NPCs to use this new attack correction type of rotation, instead of the instant “teleport-like” rotation they had between hits. Something along these lines anyway.

And Dennis admitted that he always plays with controller style mode on, so he never noticed any effect of this on the player controls. He also said they would try to find some compromise / player setting to restore the functionality at least partially.

Just thought I’d clear that up before we dive into more intense conspiracy theories :slight_smile:
Maybe @den can confirm the above?

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My 2 cents.

I like how NPCs now move more dynamic. They charge at you and attack, they actually attack you instead of just standing there doing nothing. It felt so strange before that they hesitated with their attacks.
Now - combined with Multigun’s mod which restores aggro range for NPCs - the enemy NPCs behave in the best way I have ever seen in this game.

But Funcom made the enemies more agile and at the same time Player was made less agile. Now when I fight with group of enemies I feel like my character was made of wooden block. I get hit so much more, only armor saves me. But it’s doable. It feels just strange how player’s character sometimes fails to turn. Even when we harvest resources and want to move back from the node the character walks slowly backwards and we have to stop, turn him around and then the char starts to move normally.

Some strange shit happened here Mr Dennis, and you promised not to feed us with dog poo in your last stream :clown_face:

What would I do from here…
I’d leave the NPCs how they are but reverted the changes made to how the player’s character moves.
Or even better - implemented a system that changes real agility of how the character moves according to points spent on agility and armor class that is worn.
It could be also affected by strenght…

This would have been epic.

And as for combat…

Venomous creatures need a buff to their DoT. Scorpions and snakes do not cause damage by their bites (snake’s bite is like hamster’s bite) but with the effect of their venom.
In game both creatures signal that they are about to attack for a very long time, to warn player. But the effect of venom is non existent and we can ignore it.
I’d shorten the “warning” time scorpions and snakes give and buffed the DoT from venom 10x… IRL everyone is wary of snakes and scorpions but in Conan they are ignored as simplest and weakest mobs out there.

So yes, I’m happy with what was done to NPCs, and I want more. (player and enemies walking backwards in combat is dog shit tho)
But player character’s movement is less fun right now, not because it’s harder but because it just feels odd compared to what enemies can do.

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These must be PC issues. I’m on PS5 and haven’t noticed any combat changes. I take that back, fighting has greatly improved especially when being attacked by multiple enemies.

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Combat has been fine for me on a sweaty pvp server and in a pretty decent place so long as funcom can come up with a way to punish using a bow.

People are currently using 2h axe, 2h sword, claws/chak/spike, 2h mace, and… bow.

So the variety of weapons I’m seeing instead of just spear I find refreshing.

I understand the concerns for the movement changes. It kind of makes sense for some weapons. For instance a spear instantly turning 180 degrees doesn’t seem all that realistic. However a side chopping motion of another weapon does seem reasonable.

Bow just needs to be punished if they are hit when using it, or have the animation time slightly increased, or the movement slightly nerfed.

As it is now, a proficient bow user is just playing a different game altogether.

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Could you elaborate on how fighting has been greatly improved? Your first reaction was that you hadn’t noticed anything, but then you immediately changed that to it being a whole lot better. That’s an interesting turnabout, so I’d love to hear your reasoning.

And it does seem like most of the complaints (but not all) come from PC users. Someone noted that console users are already used to this kind of combat, while PC users are used to the mouse being used for aiming.

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I haven’t heard anyone describe the new combat as “dynamic” before. Have your experienced any enemies running backwards to attack, changing direction instantly mid-charge, spinning in place to target like laser-guided turrets, and anything else…odd?

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I know I’ve asked this before, but it feels like an important question to me. Why weren’t these changes to combat previewed on Testlive? Why weren’t they included in the patch notes?

It seems like a drastic enough change that it warranted being tested just as much as the raid castle, camels, tavern, and other elements that were included.

Why the secrecy? It seems strange to me.

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I think its because the difference is a bug. The spear changes and stuff were on testlive. The enemy facing changes was also known.

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So wouldn’t notice a change made to fighting with keyboard and mouse. Sort of like saying your beer tastes the same, when we are drinking wine.

And I can do it with no weapons. That really isn’t the big brag you think it is. The keep scales to the attackers, by yourself at 10th the game is going to scale down to that. Does it still feel like the same accomplishment? Try it at 60th with 2 thralls see how that goes.

“Sorry we cut your leg off, but it’s ok,we’re going to stitch on a broom handle”. :roll_eyes:

I tell you what grab a 10 pound sludge hammer, swing it, and try to change it’s discretion mid swing.

If the NPCs can do that; track you and hit with any weapon, I aught to be able to do the same.

Lite weapons, like daggers and short swords, and medium weapons, long swords and maces should still have the previous fluid combat. Aside from specific legendary weapons {momentum}. 2 handed weapons wont be as fluid, as it is now except NPC lose the tracking ability with heavy weapons as well. Except for specific legendary weapons, the papyrus blade for insistence.

The best here is a happy medium for both player and NPC.

:man_facepalming: Have you read any part of this thread? Has been noted ad nauseum this is a PC thing.

They were, I griped about, at the time I said it would be the #1 issue discussed on the forum, and here we are.

As I have said before the “beta” server is there for content producers to preview the new content, hype the new chapter. Any issues that don’t crash your game and produce an automated bug report, won’t get fixed. It goes out as is; the issue with hard release dates.

Grab a spear, find an enemy, use the Q lockon, watch you 180 with a spear.

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These changes were on Testlive? I had read otherwise. Honestly, if they were, I would have expected a whole lot more outrage, but it only seemed to explode when Chapter 3 was released. Hmmm.

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Not many on the beta server because they see no point. Why take the time and effort to file bug reports if the update is going out as is regardless?

When 3.0 hit there were dozens of people on test, now there might be a dozen across all the beta severs.
My opinion if the beta servers were used properly we wouldn’t see half the crap we get in an update.

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Here is the thread on the beta forum where the issue was reported and - briefly - discussed.

It is worth a read. The thread is where the semi-workaround is from.

The change was NOT noted in the patch notes, which probably contributed to it not being widely discussed.

I do not know if the change was in the beta client from the beginning. There was a sneak patch during the beta period, so it may have been introduced at that point.
I played beta from the beginning, but just didn’t do much melee combat and just noticed that I fight as if drunk, but didn’t understand what had changed.

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Wak literally made a video about this on the test live lol

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Ah. I thought this was after Chapter 3 was released.

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Thanks for clarifying things. I will have to reread the patch notes. I missed the update there.

UPDATE: I just read the patch notes, and I found this statement under Combat Fixes: “Humanoid and Animal enemies will now rotate during their attacks to better track players when fighting.” That is one issue that we’ve discussed quite a bit. They also note a known issue that “The new NPC Rotation System has a few lingering issues that are not yet resolved.”

However, I don’t see anything in that section about how player controls have been modified, nor do I see anything about that in any other section of the patch notes. Of course, I obviously overlook stuff, so if anyone can point me in the right direction , I’d appreciate it. :slight_smile:

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Aaaargh! Sorry, I forgot the most important word:

The change was NOT noted in the patch notes.

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Borking your own game and taking weeks to fix it. God help us.

Even with the great combat hotfix by Xevyr the single player is still bad.

The worst thing is the monsters who turn on a sixpence that you cant dodge and and cant stun who stun you so you cant fight so you have to run around in circles till they miss you and you can get 2-3 hits before they stun you again.

Like the Khari Remnants or the Dragon bosses. Or the Rhino Boss who you have to slug it out with then run behind a rock to heal then go back to just slug it out with. Ruined.

Dreadful.

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Thanks for the correction.

So I was wrong about it not being in testlive. They just didn’t advertise the change being there or in Chapter 3 when it went live.

So my original question remains. Why the secrecy? This is a major change. Hmm.

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Strafe arena boss fights are ugly. It was cool for the new tech. It’s old enough now to be standardize. I’m talking hardware.

So… I counted hits on the prowler and stygian fighters, and they get two extra hits on me. Probably it is something with full agility perks. It’s no secret now that our toons can tumble-dodge. I can now get out of a 3v1 without stagger.

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TBH I wouldn’t put it past them to have been aware and left it out on purpose. They know when they make these unpopular changes and stick to them the fuss over it eventually dies down. They released it just before going on vacation so the players would be mostly done fussing about it by the time they got back.