Dante's Circle Agent missions... post any info you have here


#141

Hmm, I hadn’t considered the 1k shard sell price, nice point. Actually, that is likely the Best reward from a level 1 mission, assuming you get it.


#142

Most of them (all except The Island?) are dual stat missions anyway, which I believe makes them less common. I’ve finished Dante’s 9th and not seen Devil yet in a couple days worth of missions.


#143

I got to 9th Circle on Saturday and yesterday I saw Dante’s Devil for the first time. Oleg failed to be outstanding though but he is determined to make up for this perceived failure next time it shows up.


#145

so did anyone find out if there is a way to improve outstanding result chanches ?
So far I sent my best Agents out for Agent reward missions at least 20 times and only got Sarah Skelly :frowning:


#146

Some agents have +outstanding result traits. Usually associated with there being an available bonus containing that trait (it if behaves like the -time trait you don’t have to match the whole bonus, just that part of it). Petru has a universal +outstanding bonus, and solid stats, if you can put up with him being so dang Blajini. There’s also supposed to be some agent gear that provides a similar bonus, but I haven’t seen it.

What I don’t have is the actual numbers, or any statistical record. So I’m not sure how much the base chance is, how much it is increased (and whether the gear stacks with the trait), and how the roll to determine outstanding results interacts with the base success roll. Which makes it rather difficult to assess whether it’s better to send somebody with a bonus but a lower affinity, or go for somebody with no chance of “failure”. It also makes it unclear whether it’s valuable to overbuff the mission stats, or if it’s good enough once you hit 100% on the display.


#147

That’s about what I knew about it, only that I have seen sometimes 60-70% score outstanding and 100% not, so I thought there could be a hidden reason behind it, while it looks like its a matter of pure RNG.

So, out of those agents with outstanding result bonuses (which ofc I don’t have), once you have 100% it does not matter which one you send ?


#148

None of them are a guarantee… I’ve sent max-level Petru on greenhouse of horrors 4 of the 7 times I tried it and no outstandings at all. The Island is the only agent-mission I’ve got outstanding on, probably cause as a single stat one the outstanding chance is significantly higher (but even there, 5th attempt, and just using a standard agent, Maxwell Chandler).


#149

I can tell you that the purple quality Agent Uplink gear increases affinity by 1% (assuming it’s not already 100%, naturally) regardless of any other factors, so if you had another agent with identical stats to Petru you could compare them both on a mission and work out what his bonus outstanding chance is.

As far as I can tell, affinity is your success chance plus your outstanding chance and the system works off a single roll. No idea what the base chance of outstanding is.


#150

Petru has 4-6% advantage on missions but he increases both affinity and outstanding chances so it’s probably 4% of one, 1% of the other or something.

Mine’s at 250/440/250 though so I can’t really compare dual stat missions to any other agents, none also have 250+250.


#151

I did find that for an epic piece of gear to only increase the chance 1% pretty disappointing. I would have expected 2-5% up to 10%, considering the RNG of agent missions anyway. As it stands, I don’t use it, as why? 101% doesn’t seem to matter.


#152

Because that 1% is outstanding chance. Say the base chance of getting an outstanding result is 1% (as an example - I don’t actually know what it is) and your agent has 100% affinity - they have a 99% chance to get a successful result and a 1% chance to get outstanding. By equipping the uplink, you would effectively double the chances of getting an outstanding result.

So if you’re trying to get an outstanding result it’s always better to equip the uplink, even if your agent only had say, 40% affinity.


#153

now this what we don’t know because we don’t know what outstanding base chance is and how bugged the formula can be. But let me show few models.

BASICS

Model 1: outstanding is percent of base affinity.

So if you have 100% then outstanding would be like 5% overall, while for 20% affinity it would be 1% overall. With the behind formula working either on 95-5 (19-1) basis [VariantA] or two step: determine success 100 (20) then second 5% check if it’s outstanding (resulting in 5% (1%) overall) [VariantB]. There is also sloppy [VariantC] in which chances are separated parts instead of “chance”. So instead of “5% of base affinity” it’s “1 part outstanding, 19 parts success, 80 parts fail” and they are later affected separately (more later)

Model 2: outstanding is flat once you can run the mission.

Since minimum is 33% it may be 5% flat chance no matter affinity. This would mean that once you can run mission you have same outstanding chance no matter affinity. 5% of them would be outstanding. This would mean that running 33% chance missions would yield more outstanding among succeeded ones

Model 2 seems unlikely as I don’t think we observe higher outstanding ratio in urgent missions. It would also mean that you should never see 0% affinity as the minimum should be the flat chance. This leads me to believe model 1 is more likely used.

UPLINK

Uplink seems to add flat affinity chance. (Purple +1%, Yellow close to 2%, rounding may apply). Assuming it’s flat outstanding chance.

So it’s either [model 2] and this simply adds to it. Or [M1VarA]: 95-5 would change to 94-6, 19-1 would change (somehow) to 19-2. Also without assumptions unknown how >100% really works. For like 140% affinity base could be 133-7 and with uplink 133-8 and only rounded visually.

STAT ITEMS

Another layer are stat items (weaponry, belt, spheres). Let’s assume specific mission and item that adds 40% affinity (for same mission type [tier-value] bonus is almost flat no matter agent. There is minor non-linearity, it may go from 36-38 - which is beyond rounding error - with being lower the higher base affinity is. Might be caused by stat cap (it was only 36 for skill above 500, 37-38 for the rest).

So how stat item affinity affects outstanding:

Model 3: Stat items are pure affinity bonus instead of stat bonus. So from 19-1 you get 59-1. From 57-3 you get 97-3

Model 4: Stat items adds to base affinity formula before outstanding part it taken. So from 19-1 you get 57-3 and from 57-3 you get 95-5

Now, there is inconsistency how game threats agent stats and items. It is presented as that items adds flat stat and then it is used for formulas (supports Model 4), but even if you match one agent stats with an item to same numbers as the other agent their affinities will not match despite inert traits.

+STAT TRAIT

the ones that states +prowess +adaptability +ingenuity. Their interaction with stats/outstanding is another unknown (tried to find the formula to stat-affinity to determine these bonuses but ended up with proof that stats we see don’t determine the chance, or some agents have hidden bonuses not mentioned in traits… there really are a lot of sloppy bugs around what we see and what we get and FC is not even bothered with reported ones).

But what we know. Traits are not flat additive (agent lvl 1 would have had much higher stats) and it’s not multiplicative (stats from gear should be affected as well). So it’s somewhere in between, impossible to tell. If it only adds affinity or affects outstanting (or doesn’t work at all)… unknown.

+OUTSTANDING TRAIT

another fun/bugged unknown. It may be flat bonus as uplink item. Or it may add to base outstanding chance used to determine the basic success-outstanding ratio (so instead 19-1 you get 18-2; instead of 5% now we have 10%, AKA +100% outstanding bonus, would be lower, don’t want to deal with fractures).

It is observed that agent using or not using his outstanding trait has the same exact affinity (same mission, once with and once without the bonus rewards).

So if trait outstanding bonus is flat it’s either below 1% (rounding error might show same number in cases) or not working at all (AKA bugged). Or it’s affecting base chance - cannot determine how much and also all beforementioned things apply. Like is the outstanding trait boosted by stat item or not? (So standard 19-1 with outstanding trait 18-2 and stat item will be 58-2 (pure affinity bonus) or 54-6 (true base outstanding bonus) or something in between?)

CONCLUSION

These are half variants how it can work.

It’s nearly impossible to know with many agents having condition changing traits, with true base outstanding being likely 2% rather then 5% used in all examples so statistical data would be required to be huge, and with uncertainty from FC that anything could be bugged, that what you see is not what game actually use (as seen in bugged agent traits or missions numbers that are easily noticeable and even reported are not fixed, not to mention half passives/weapons/talismans being bugged with FC having no idea how it works/interacts with other things).

I blame Funcom for this. Systems (AKA game rules) should be simple and either transparent or done with precision. What we constantly get is obfuscated buggy nondeterministic black boxes. FC cannot make them work well but we cannot even find bugs other then randomly, always wondering if it’s feature or bug. This is true for almost every passive/weapon/talisman. But for agent, the minimum they should learn from is STO and its showing for critical fail, normal success, critical success chance. No big deal. But since we are not even allowed to see core fatigue mechanic…

So @Pilchenstein… using uplink with 40% affinity might or might not be good idea. You cannot tell (the only “might” is [Model 2] which seems unlikely). Agent with 100% affinity might (and should, but still might not) get higher affinity then what 40% + uplink gets.


#154

Yeah, outstanding stats…

After they fixed chains I logged 155 missions. 12 of them were outstanding, 11 of which were T1 missions. 11/76 T1, 0/37 T2, 0/17 T3, 1/10 T4, 0/15 T5.

If affinity scales the way you’d expect my agents have gotta be in the like, 400-600% affinity range. Of that, 15% outstanding means ~2.5% of affinity is outstanding.


#155

I have no idea what any of this is meant to mean. :v:

It seems more than likely that “affinity” is just your percentage chance of success plus your percentage chance of outstanding. If not, then why does the uplink always increase affinity by one percent?

I see what you’re getting at but this is probably wrong. Affinity can’t go above 100% but raising your stats beyond what’s needed for 100% does increase your outstanding chance (according to Glaucon) though not by much (otherwise the uplink would be worthless).

For lower tier missions, it may well be that using a stat item increases outstanding chance by more than the uplink (assuming your agent is already at 100% affinity) but from what I was told, stats only increase outstanding chance once you’re past 100% affinity so if your agent isn’t hugely overpowered for the mission, the uplink is probably better.

The analogy Glaucon used was how rolling a natural 20 in D&D is always a crit but you can get an ability that makes 19-20 a crit. The agent uplink works the same way, though obviously the numbers involved are different.


#156

No offense to Glaucon, but from what I’ve seen - denial of fatigue, broke agent mission chains, etc., I’m not sure any ONE dev has a clue what is going on or exactly how the agent system works. Considering how many things have been buggy/broken in TSW/SWL that we’ve lived with for 5+ years, you can never tell if it truly is working as intended, or was released with bugs that haven’t been fixed yet, until enough people complain and it gets fixed.

Back in April, on four characters I did 1369 missions (all levels I didn’t track them by tier), 72 were outstanding and 10 were fails. The fails were all below 70% affinity, closer to under 50% (usually trying for the blue bags on not quite there agents!). In general, I try to always do 100% affinity missions and match the bonus if it’s available, so 72 out of 1369, to me, seems pretty low on the outstanding success. I have a full set of purple and blue agent gear on one character. The rest have various pieces to up their success too.

As for the RNG of this whole mini-game, I don’t know if it’s just me, but since Friday-ish 25th, I’ve only see the Sarah Skelly agent mission (two picked her up Thursday/Friday). Again on 4 characters doing agent missions at least 3x a day, so maybe it’s bad RNG on my part or has it been adjusted down to see the last tier?


#157

Yes, bugs are a thing that exist. If we see evidence that the agent system doesn’t work the way it should, then it might be bugged but so far, it looks like it works the way he described it, so I’m not sure what your point is.

72 out of 1369 is about 5%, so not that low at all really.


#158

Since when has complaining gotten anything fixed in this game?


#159

Anima Shot got a fix in early 2016 based on complaints.

On a brighter note, Oleg managed to bring me Virgil on attempt #3, so he made up for past failures.


#160

Virgil? That reminds me, wasn’t there complaints about those impossible agent mission chains? And I could swear Funcom said the system was bugged before fixing that, too.


#161

The agent chains were bugged before they were fixed, yes. That’s generally the order these things happen in. :v: