I believe armor and armor pen is the root of all evil to player/thrall balance

After playing this game since launch and seeing the various iterations of thrall power, I believe what the game really needs is an adjustment to the armor system and also armor penetration on weapons/fittings.

I would suggest the following as a good starting point (obviously would need tested):

Light = 20% DR
Med = 30% DR
Heavy = 40% DR

Next, exceptionally crafted armor and armor kits will add % armor value increase opposed to flat amounts:
Exceptional will add 5%, so that is 21% light, 32% med, and 42% heavy
Flawless would add 10%, (22% light, 33% med, and 44% heavy)
Legendary would add 15%, (23% light, 35% med, and 46% heavy)
Armor kits add 5/10/15% increases, so similar bumps as exceptional and flawless
Bulking armor kit add 20% increase at cost of extra weight

Agility would add armor up to 10% DR at 50 points.

So max damage reduction would be heavy legendary armor with bulking armor kits with 50 in agility at 64% DR

Also, with this change I would cap all armor pen on weapons to a max of 30%, which master kits adding 5% and a straight armor pen kit adding 10%. It should work as a reduction and not a flat value drop. So a max armor pen weapon with a spiked weapon fitting would drop that heavy legendary with bulking kit from 64% to 38% DR. Also, all high armor pen weapons should have lower damage values on average.

Keep in mind that there would need to be player/monster health adjustments, as well as damage adjustments to really balance this change. But I feel the changes I am suggesting to armor and armor pen is a needed catalyst to making this game more balanced.

1 Like

I typed this out on my phone in line at Kroger… so there may be math or spelling errors :stuck_out_tongue:

Without considering the math for now, could you explain why you feel that armor and armor penetration is the problem. Rather than trying to analyze whether you have the right numbers in your calculations, I’d like to understand the train of thought that led you to think this is the problem (and the solution).

Thanks in advance.


The current damage reduction issue is the main reason pets are inferior to thralls and also why heavy armor is so essential currently. The top end damage reduction of around 81-82% is simply to high. Bosses need to do incredible damage to have a chance to threaten a player in top end armor, so they are very lethal vs lesser armored people. Also, the boss damage is adjusted to not one shot a heavy armored player, then they are weak compared to a thrall in that armor, since the thrall has so high health to counter the poor AI. This is compounding the powerful thrall issue.

The armor pen situation is largely due to PvP. This is another band-aid approach to help players counter the heavy armor. It would not feel so required if the armor’s damage reduction was more reasonable. Currently the only recourse a PvPer has is use a combination of armor pen+bleeds+poison to kill others in heavy armor. Things that work around the armor, which is fine, but the armor pen feels so essential. Hence the out cry when the 4th perk was removed from Accuracy. This is because top end heavy armor is too good.

This also trivializes agility and armor mods. That shouldnt be the case. Those applied bonuses should be viable for heavy armor as well. Another symptom of an armor system that is out of balance. Another example is agility on a thrall. Nearly useful currently because it provides so little help due to diminishing returns, since the armor we give them is too powerful.

I honestly just threw up napkin math as more of a placeholder. This is really about spreading out the armor types in protection, while also lowering them to keep agility and armor mods useful at all stages.


I don’t fully understand why damage penetration is the problem to be honest. Doesn’t damage penetration affect heavy armors proportionally more than light armors?

So max damage reduction would be heavy legendary armor with bulking armor kits with 50 in agility at 64% DR

A legendary light armor with a best armor kit and 50 agility would be 0.26 + 0.20*0.15 + 0.10 = 0.39 = 39%.

A legendary heavy armor which is bulked up for extra weight would then let in 36 damage out of 100, while a light armor would let in 61, an improvement of 70%. In other words; If you died in 5 seconds with a light armor, with a heavy armor you would survive 8.5 seconds.

I don’t find that trade quite worth it, on paper at least, though of course I can’t say for sure until I tried it. 5 seconds of taking damage but you can dodge a lot more and further and can jump over obstacles etc to flee vs 8.5 seconds but you can’t really dodge except very short distances and will be out of stamina if you try any climbing or jumping? Eh…

I kind of like the approach where heavy armor is roughly twice more protection than a medium armor but with a significant cost for dodging and climbing, while medium armor is around 50% more protection than light armor (aside of certain legendary combos), with moderate mobility cost. So heavy armor is roughly 3x more damage being blocked than a light armor (not actually true, it’s less than that, but anyhow).

Currently a flawless epic Zamorian set is 160 armor; flawless epic Aquilonian set 419; and flawless epic Stygian set 960. In damage reduction, that’s ~39%, ~62%, ~78%. Meaning that a heavy armor lets through around 3x less damage than a light armor - when we aren’t considering agility. If we did, then it would be less than 3x.

The numbers were just a guess and would need to be play tested. The intent is to drop the top end DR that is reachable from around 82% to around 60ish%. A drop of 20% DR. The other armor types can be spaced appropriately to make each category matter.

Armor pen enters this scenario after the top end is reduced. No need for it to be so high if armor overall provides less protection.

This topic was automatically closed 7 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.