I don't get the PvE vs PvP distinction on this forum

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You didn’t understand my point. By balanced I mean that no item/armor is clearly superior (OP) in PvP or PvE. I think SoC was OP in both so nerfing it made sense to me from a pure PvE and PvP standpoint. A double positive with no negatives in my eyes.

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I think this may be another essential disconnect. This game is not an eSports title, and some items being strictly better than others is a feature, not a flaw. Particularly if those items require a heavy time investment to acquire.

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You know it’s exactly crap like this that people are talking about, right?

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You are right it’s not an esport title. I still want hard to acquire items to be better than other items, just not so much that an item makes it feel like I turned on cheats (like SoC on a thrall in PvE). The game has a great variety of armor, weapons and potential attribute builds but if certain weapons/armor/builds are clearly OP then that variety is more or less for nothing imo.

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the neverending debate between diversity VS efficiency

Found this just now on another thread and for me, it sums up the divide:

The problem is, some (PvE) players really enjoy Scorpion because of his colors and cool weapon and he is on the cover and is undead, etc etc etc that has NOTHING to do with his special move being insta kill. When the PvP player cries "please this is not cool (because there are 39 other characters that would be nice to fight but nobody plays them) can you nerf Scorpion, the PvE Scorpion fans :sob:

Scorpion is the meta, PvP players don’t want a meta. They want arrows, bombs, spears, axes, shields, daggers, orbs, traps - everything the game has thrown at them! OR be able to pick what you love (Sub Zero) and it can be as good as Scorpion (assuming skill level is on par).

Anywho, hope this helps…I get it

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Mortal Kombat doesn’t have a PvE mode (obvious, I know, but that’s why it’s not a great example).

There will always be a (perceived) meta. The best any game can hope for (if their goal is no meta) is a rotating meta, or one that is diffuse enough that player skill is the determining factor most of the time.

But yes, you are correct: PvP players want everything to be equally good, meaning no weapon can be better than another, and that is not what PvE players want. They (we) enjoy spending time finding better or more interesting weapons.

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Out of all of that you took the part that I assumed people could follow, sorry. I’ll restate:

…can you nerf Scorpion?" When this happens the Scorpion fans (the people who enjoy the character for non PvP reasons as I stated to already) are displeased because they don’t understand why he is not as good as he was before the nerf.

So I clearly understand there is no PvE mode but it has LORE and other NON-PVP factors that give it’s characters some worth. And since the characters themselves are the weapons then they are also analogous to items in Conan.

The more levels you look, the better the example gets!

Now as far as the meta part, ill try again to explain:

relatively level selection with multitudes of options and effects. FC is getting better at this but still has some quirks (like 100% AP warmaker stuff or glitched claws). Overall there are more people using weapons beside just the spear now.

This. this. this.

To me good game design is a balance of risk v reward. It is human nature. Did i get proper compensation for what i do? That is what we ask ourselves daily, if not in every decision.

Perhaps the answer to LBS was a slight nerf to healing and a large nerf to damage? It’s not a great spear but it’s a good enough heal to justify me spending time having it on my wheel. We all look at the trade off, the opportunity cost of what we carry.

To be honest, it’s a matter of perspective.

PvPers think PvE is meaningless and their needs are more important.
PvEers think PvP is just full of griefers and jerks, and their desires are ruining the PvE experience.

PvP and PvE should have had a clearly defined separation from the beginning. It should be a thing in any game where both are possible.

Personally, I hate PvP. My experience began around a decade ago in WoW, and all I saw of PvP players were ■■■-holes who abused the system and griefed lower level players. Because PvP brings out the jerk in most players. They get on a power trip and think they are entitled to abuse weaker players, because they are weaker. Just a typical bully thing.

I’d rather PvP fixes not mess with my PvE experience. I shouldn’t have to sacrifice quality gear, because the PvPers complain it is overpowered.

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this is about as far off as possible.

PVPers utilize PVE for everything we do in PVP. Can not explain it anymore than many have. We do PVE just like everyone else, with the only real difference is hazard. IF anything, we have to constantly farm even more to keep rebuilding supplies on hand (or hidden tbh).

Now if you were to change that to PVP feels RP is meaningless, then that may be more accurate (not that i agree or disagree with the RP opinion). PVP does not have many uses for place-ables, outside of lag builds and base markers. Yet, i have never seen one PVP post say take all the empty bowls out of my loot tables. We deal with it, because we know someone wants to build an RP base with a full plate setting (sans food in them lol–which i would be all for).

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I don’t think you got the point of this thread at all. All PvPers are PvE players. By complaining about OP gear we impact our own pve experience just as much as yours , and we do a lot of PvE.

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If a PvP player argues against a piece of gear that is only OP when used in PvP, and that piece of gear gets nerfed, making it essentially useless in PvE play, then that becomes a problem in and of itself.

That’s the point of when PvP players become a problem for PvE players. And why a lot of PvE players don’t like PvP players, regardless of whether they play PvE.

Maybe some nerfs suggested by PvP players are actually good for the game. Yet that doesn’t automatically mean they all are.

I’m fairly certain changes have been made in Conan that were purely done for the benefit of the PvP community, and only ended up as a detriment to the PvE one.

The whole “no bandaging while you are moving” and “no healing regen if you take damage” seem expressly like something to benefit the PvP community, while hindering those who only play PvE. Since PvP players are the only ones who ever complain about “spam healing”.

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Most pvp players also want pve to be challenging. Healing is too easy in both pvp and pve, so no, it’s not just a pvp argument. Same goes for SoC nerf, bearer dmg nerf (highest dmg, loads of HP and biggest inventory+ no drawbacks, like wtf) and lots of other changes. I think healing needs an animation or stamina drain, but that’s a different topic.

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It’s not the players fault that an item is nerfed too much, that’s on FC. Nobody asked for those items to become useless

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Extreme difficulty where?

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I think the main distinction between the 2 is that in pvp other players can destroy your buildings and take your loot,basically all your hard work down the drain and pve you have peace of mind in that sense but other than that I think everything else is the same.

Yes. Most PvP players are making complaints under the cover of saying it’s to “improve the PvE” gameplay. When really they want the changes to make their PvP more of a challenge.

I think they need to completely remove all of the PvP nerfs, and instead force them solely on the PvP players.

This thread is about UNDERSTANDING the distinction between the two games modes and perhaps an attempt to bridge the divide.

IT IS NOT about what one side thinks needs to happen to the other.