The PVE Builder

“Please remember that there are other players sharing the server with you. Restricting others’ access to content is not allowed beyond of course grabbing a spot for your base. If you wish to reign supreme on the map and hog all the resources and enemies, please consider single player or setting up your own server, or - in the case of PvP servers - play fair.”

They literally qualify the rules before stating them in bullet point order.

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Thats not the point and if you tock the time to read the hole thing you understand. The so caled rules is unspesifide fluff and dont tell wher the line is, the only spec is that you will be baned whit no warning if you block one stonenode.

Awww you’re talking about Pwny’s wall. So many memories

They do tell you where the line is, but they don’t quantify it in simple numbers. And if you took the time to think about it, you would understand why: if I tell you that the limit is 20,000 foundations (for example), you’ll still be able to screw up the whole server with 19,999 and claim that you didn’t break the rules.

No, it’s not. The rules don’t actually state that. The rules list “some specific cases” which they will act upon and one of those cases is “blocking of content in the game, such as dungeons, obelisks, resources and other areas of the game”.

Notice that they do not specify which resources or how many of them, precisely because of people like you, who like to nitpick the rules and pretend they don’t understand them. That way, if I build my base and it blocks the spawn of 3 bushes and 2 trees, they won’t have to ban me if some troll reports me.

See, that’s what people just refuse to understand about the rules: they’re deliberately made to give enough discretion to the admins. If there was an easy way to determine each base’s impact on the server performance, then Funcom wouldn’t need to make rules about this. They could just implement an in-game limit and be done with this whole toxic farce.

Obviously, they don’t have that. So what are their options?

One of them would be to set a limit on the number of building pieces and/or placeables you can use. Would that help? No, because it’s not merely about the number, it’s also about how you place the stuff. For a simple numeric limit to be actually useful, they would have to make it ridiculously low, and basically make everyone quit the game.

Another option would be to invest a fuсkton of time and effort into developing a system that would measure the impact of each base on the performance – without that system itself becoming a drain on server performance – and then expose that measurement through their GUI and implement a limit around it. Even if we assume that’s technically feasible – and that’s a big assumption – it would likely be a huge undertaking that would tie up several developers and slow down work on everything else that people are complaining about. Oh, and it would definitely introduce some nice, juicy new bugs.

Orrrrrrr… they could just, you know, have rules against people who build in a way that makes the server shіt the bed. Seems like a reasonable cost/benefit tradeoff. :man_shrugging:

That’s actually a fair point.

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Well i dont think i brake the rules but its hard to tell whit the unspesifide fluff rules and as @Halk say its open for the eye of the beholder and they deserve to know it beforehand!!!

But what Funcom cud have done whit a simle way is to extend the none build areas and ad a land clame restricing areas whit claming flaggs or somthing ells that have bean up in the forum so many times sins the game started.

How would a no-build zone help with people whose builds cause server lag? Not client lag, by the way, server lag.

You know how you can tell your server is screwed up by overbuilding? It’s when you’re nowhere near anyone’s base, and yet you’re lagging every time someone else happens to pass by a massive theme park. Ain’t gonna solve that with a no-build zone.

If you’re on PC, it’s really easy to see when you’re on a server that’s totally screwed up by overbuilding. Just use the ToggleDebugHUD console command and keep an eye on the “server FPS” number in the top right corner. Whenever it goes orange or red, that’s when the server is having performance problems.

If that consistently happens whenever someone goes near a specific base, then that base is definitely contributing to server performance problems.

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The none build Zones will help to prevent blocking of resourses, and mob spawns. If you get baned if you build on a spec spot it shud be an none build area. And if they link together several nonbuild areas you cant block stuff off.

And when a building starts to be a problem its not that hard to limit the build cap on that data.

So extended non build zones and limiting the land clameing will help alot. + a preformer block on more build parts.

And a clear warning b4 you get baned.

I play all types of servers, and have seen all types of egregious examples (honestly there are some truly obnoxious builds out there heh) and also some supremely awesome builds.

As an offline PVE player , or playing in single-player mode, I HATE not being able to build wherever I like, and the no build zones have been annoying.

As a PVP player, or even just playing PVE online, I TOTALLY get it, lol

Unless they introduce some slider or toggle aspect in the server settings that allow activating or deactivating no-build zones , then all we are left with is a compromise between the two.

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Yes it shud be a way to turn off the none build areas for singel server and even as an option to privat servers.

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I agree with that would be very useful.

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Yes, you can. You just build bigger. I’ve seen people build a freaking highway spanning the whole map, do you really think a dedicated troll can’t do the same?

Did you even read what I wrote? Yes, it is hard to implement a useful limit on building, because it’s not just about the number of pieces. I can give you a whole bunch of technical reasons for that, but why should I, if you don’t even bother to read?

Yes, that would be useful for cases where they determine that a build screws up the server performance but they can see that it wasn’t an obviously malicious build.

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Well depends on how they ad the non build areas and ex if they link togheter the sal lake whit the oblelisk and then to the undead city and styginan town and so on it will be almost impseble but also pointless walls when players can get accs to the area via the non build areas. And in combo whit a limet nr of ex landclaming flags it will be imosble to wall it in. And if a troll manage to find a way its time for next step.

Yes i read the thing, yes its hard to set a nr on it but as you wrote when the server strss go yelow a warning popup shud come up and red no longer able to build/plase anythiung more. But i dont realy know how to use the use the ToggleDebugHUD console command. And i guess my internet make me more lag then the server do.

After all its stuffs they shud try to test to make so they have the tools when they make the DUNE game and so.

Yeah, sure. It would also make it impossible to build many of the perfectly normal bases that don’t bother anyone and don’t break any rules, bases which exist right now on many servers.

Here, let me ping @Croms_Faithful while he’s still on these forums and ask him how he feels about the idea of extending no-build zones until they’re linked together and prevent even more people from building normal bases. I’m sure his language will be polite, but very creative.

The server FPS is a number that tells you how many full update cycles the server was able to do per second. It doesn’t actually tell you what made the update cycle run for longer than 33 milliseconds, or which player caused that.

So what exactly is your proposal? Are you saying that every time the server FPS temporarily dips into single digits all players on the server are blocked from placing anything? For how long? As long as the FPS is low? What happens when the players move out of the range of the massive build that’s causing it and the server FPS goes back into green? Does everyone get unblocked from building then and we can keep making the server more overburdened?

Honestly, do you really think that if they could use the server FPS measurement to implement a limit, they wouldn’t do that?

I don’t know why I bother. Just like everyone on Twitter is suddenly an expert virologist when it comes to COVID, everyone on the forums is suddenly an expert game dev.

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Ok its hard to se who create the lag i se. I dont know how it works and dont know what data funcom can get from the servers and evel less what they can do whit that data but hoped they can help some to limit it. But thanks for trying to explain it.

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The road system, keep, map rooms in various locations was cool. The massive wall, took a bit to draw for me so I can image what it was like for others. I had fond memories of 1941 during the 2019 season I played. I returned in late 2020 and the roads and such were gone. I am guessing the walled city as well.

I had the only other base inside the walls that I maintained out of principal. But I’ll stop detailing the topic, nice to see another 1941er

You bother because we love you. Even Mas.

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How very presumptuous of you.

In fact I am very familiar with the whole of the updated TOS as well as the old TOS and have displayed such in the numerous other threads on this topic. I very much understand what is going on here.

The rules are specific and sufficient for the majority of the player base and have been since the old TOS. You can not like them all you want, and propose changes, but until you provide actual evidence that they are lacking, IMO - you are crying wolf.

To your point about a warning, while I agree in intent, it makes the already slow process more cumbersome. How long before a warning can be acted upon? If it is altered after a warning and still doesn’t comply, another warning? It is no different than limits, except FC has to give it to players individually on a case by case basis.

I can’t say I totally disagree with that point of view. You make valid points. While most have been grateful, there have indeed been those that don’t like extra map rooms and elevators in certain areas, or the offer of thralls, armor, weapons, tools etc.

While an argument could certainly be made not all players like or appreciate the help, I still would not place us into a category of being toxic to the game or server, which was why I was both confused and offended by the hostility, stupidity, and/ or disrespect.

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There certainly is a lot of confusion on many aspects of the rules, imho. While an awesome, helpful long-time player had his base wiped with no understanding of why, nor any warning, we had an issue on the server over a year ago that made it all more confusing.

Some jerk had spent an enormous amount of resources building a 10+ story wall around the entirety of sepermeru and the closest obelisk. Nearly the entire server banded together constantly sending messages to funcom about it; countless messages, posts, and screenshots. We did this repeatedly for nearly 11 MONTHS before funcom took action and wiped a section of it, if I recall correctly, just the area around the obelisk. Less than a month later, there were virtually no trick to get into sepermeru, and if you could, no way to drag a thrall out, stayed like that for months until he switched servers.

Many of us have had a hard time understanding what exactly does it take to get them to intervene on an official server, other times it seems they will take action for reasons that wouldn’t seem like it would warrant their attention.

Perhaps I’m missing something or just not educated enough in this field. That said, I guess I personally feel that while I cannot offer solid solutions to various problems, those that are hired and work on the game should be able to do a bit better. If people buy someone’s products or services, I don’t think it unusual to expect the provider/ creator to come up with the solutions, while the consumer should have the right to say something is broken or makes no sense, then expect them to fix it.

They’re the paid professionals, I’ll just voice my discontent with something. Sadly they do not seem to have enough staff to field complaints or deal with clients / consumers and our only hope in getting heard is to post it on a forum and hope they see it or will address it. But from what I’ve seen, they usually only get the attention of other players, that ultimately can’t do anything about it and are rarely “in the know”.

Most of the posts I’ve read have players legitimately trying to help, and others that just seem to just enjoy running their mouth and busting people’s chops. Regardless of any potential solutions to a large variety of problems, it appears (to my untrained eye) that they are too understaffed, or priorities are solely putting out new content to sell instead of fixing/ optimizing content already released and purchased. Though I could definitely be mistaken.

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