I’m trying to keep up with this discussion while maintaining productivity, it’s spanned multiple threads at this point. Is there info from FC specifically regarding POIs? Or are we as a forum working under the assumption that they are covered by the “other areas” clause?
Those damn things are everywhere. In meta spots as well. If they are righteously enforcing POIs as blocked content, I think we gone too far.
YEP! YEP YEP. When someone put up the location markers is what killed someone else in the crevice, I finally understood what is going on and it makes sense…although it maybe legit as far as POI, I disagree that it needs to be that granular…but at the same time, how is the moderator supposed to know that this vista is worth it but this marker of a cave isn’t. So I think a petition to remove these marker locations unless there is something of value needs to be done.
Yeah, I have no idea how we are supposed to parse out enforcement like that given our info. If I build in the crevice but only in the center such that you can still pass under the mountain - am I good? What if I block the passway but ensure you can still unlock the map marker?
That’s assuming they ARE enforcing based on POI blocking. Even that is just an assumption based on some’s collective experiences.
Boss spawns, obelisk, dungeons? Sure. I can even understand location restricted resources. POIs and generic resources has got to be hyperbolic from players grasping for understanding right?
Edit:
I could even understand complete blocking of a POI, though that would eliminate some meta PVP spots - top of those tall islands east of Flotsom spring to mind. I don’t think it’s necessary, but I could understand it.
If it is true about all these poi’s then I doubt you’d be safe. I mean if we can’t build there what is even the point of it? Go in it once look at a big cave unlock the location and never go back.
I think if you are not blocking access, you should be fine.
You are likely correct. I wish we didn’t have to guess.
I think like anything else in life; you have to make a judgement call.
Correct. I haven’t seen any confirmation from Funcom about it.
On the other hand, I confess I really don’t understand why the idea is so surprising. Even if the answer is “because some PVP players traditionally depend on building their bases in some spots”, I think it’s been proven that Funcom are willing to upend these “traditions” if they think it’s necessary.
From what I’ve gathered in these discussions, it looks like there are certain locations where you can build an unraidable base. If that’s the case, why do people here think Funcom would want to offer servers where one clan can have such a clearly and overwhelmingly unfair advantage?
we are experiencing more or less the same.
the hackers are out of control, this ruin system dude is able to speedhack, put bombs invisible and climb at the speed of light among other things.
2 days ago we were defending our base vs hackers who could hit us from outside and we only managed to survive because of the spot we had our base.
if that is correct they should simply remove these spots entirely and force people to build in open field.
SPECIALLY the dam. it is almost impossible to raid with someone online and the only way to enter is by breaking the spirit of the defender in a constant siege and maybe expending 30 k of dp or more.
and i don’t know or think that nerfing the drawbridge like is going to happen next patch is going to stop that spot from being unradiable.
I can’t speak for others, but it’s only surprising to me in that it calls for yet more adjustment from the PVP playerbase. I think you are right in saying that FC seems opposed to unraidable bases, they have expressed such directly in the past.
I suppose I would just rather they solve why players tend towards unraidable. I don’t buy that it’s just because we are all sweaty degenerates, though I understand our representation here suggests otherwise. Siege economy is and has been busted for a long time. I could rattle on about offlining, but I know that you know the talking points.
If contorting to ever stricter rules is what’s required to play CE official PVP, it’s what I will do. It just feels like (and my feelings could very well be wrong) they are asking us to bend, and suffer the consequences of failing to do so, rather than addressing a core issue of balance.
Seriously? Are you freaking kidding me?
Completely remove bits of map for everyone playing this game because PVP players can use it unfairly. Look, I can totally agree with the idea of making them no-build zones after the 3.0 update adds the server setting for no-build zones, but this?!? How do you expect anyone to take such a selfish idea seriously???
Hell no, it doesn’t suggest that. And I agree that this is a problem that needs solving. Why would anyone not want to have an unraidable base if the alternative is getting offlined and having to invest days of effort to jump back in?
I think if it build up time and destruction prep time we’re in better parity, it would sting a lot less. It seems like that’s where @den’s thought were in the livestream, when he suggested increasing gather rates on PVP servers. IMO that’s a band-aid. Finding a balance between feel good PVE progression and a reasonable item gap between fresh/wiped PvP players and geared ones is a monumental task. Nonetheless, I think it is the key.
My guess is there is some sarcasm here.
i did not explained myself correctly, i mean, make no-build zones or modify the terrain in a way that is not as broken as the keyhole base. not remove the area
it can be even only on pvp servers, it doesn’t have to affect all game modes
i mean that there are options to make all building spots more “balanced”.
but if you are an alpha clan and you have the dam, you are basically unradiable.
if funcom is really worried about a clan having an inmmense advantage then they should start from there imo.
This is pretty much a myth other than 1 spot (the dam) and even there you need someone to defend. Nothing is unraidable and no the crevice is not even close to that status
It probably is, but like you said, it’s hard to come up with something even close to useful.
Thanks for explaining, and sorry if I sounded too harsh, but it really shocked me. Yeah, I can totally agree with the no-build zones idea as soon as they’re something people can turn off when they’re not on officials.
Well, they will only have one map for all servers types so either it’s no build for all or build for all. To set up something as you suggestion would take some serious programming, which would be unlikely in the dev’s work plan.
They aren’t unraidable. Just more difficult to crack open. The crevice has 3 points of access (four if you fail to look up) and Ice casm has two…i think ( I just can’t build in there because the last time I did, my daughters were at an age when I heard “Let it Go” 500 times too many and I can’t build in ice anymore) The only one of the mainstays that has one opening of reasonable size is the bunker at the great dam and I don’t believe that one is marked with a POI…just surrounded by them so expansion outward is touchy.
But the point is that these spots (as well as some others) just exude base building potential (think Field of Dreams whispers here when you first come in contact with these spaces). I would bet real money these were designed to in fact house players and, as i said before, marked just to label the spot as prime real estate. Flash forward 5 years and now we are discussing if these marks are making the spots as areas where not to build. Something went wrong here (as with most bureaucracies) if this is accurate because we lost the intent of these design elements and the letter of the law matters more now.
I don’t agree. The meta on PVP servers has almost always trended toward “unraidable” bases. I put that in quotations because I mean practically or approaching - not literally unraidable. Undermesh, flying, outside green wall, fence stacking - different methods, different times, same motivations.
I would agree that keyhole bases like the damn are the closest thing to “unraidable” barring TOS infractions right now. There are a few ceiling base spots and a few other keyhole type locations, but nothing so well known and often used as the dam.
FWIW I wasn’t trying to imply the crevice is a good base location, it was an example based on a previous post that mentioned that spot.
Okay, so there are now at least two PVP players saying that these spots aren’t unraidable. FWIW, I can neither agree nor disagree, because I don’t play on PVP servers, but I have to confess I find this discussion fascinating.
If we assume that Ceronesthes is right and there are ways to make your base essentially unraidable, I can understand why Funcom wouldn’t want that.
If we assume that you are right and these aren’t unraidable (or hard enough to raid to make building there overwhelmingly unfair), then the only thing I can think of is that Funcom don’t want people to be unable to finish a particular journey step. If that happens to be the case, that’s not something I would personally agree with, even on PVE(-C) servers. Some of those spots really are a nice challenge to build inside and really do seem like they were designed to house players, as @erjoh put it. My personal preference would be to let them, but I understand that this is my own selfish impulse, because I don’t play as a completionist myself 
If those spots really don’t offer such an unfair advantage as people claim to, then I think what changed is Funcom’s vision of what should be allowed on official servers and what should be left for private servers and single-player.
I mean, who hasn’t ever thought of building their own little house in Sepermeru? And yet, it’s definitely not a good idea to allow that on officials, even if you make it impossible (or forbidden by rules) to nuke the spawns.