No, thank you. I already invested too much of my time into this pointless conversation. If at this point you don’t see why this kind of practice is bad, I don’t think I will be able to find the words to explain it. I am sorry @Taemien I didn’t even read your replies to me. I hope you didn’t miss something important writing so much.
last post in this thread, i promise.
I don’t think saving time is equivalent to cutting the sandwich in half.
Time has value.
Some people have more time than others.
For someone with less time and the resources to spare, taking advantage of something that saves them time may have value for them.
I am not trying to make the argument that the Premium Battle Pass is worth the extra money, because I don’t think it is.
I actually liked the BP, as a “step in the right direction”. Could it have been better? Definitely. But I was pleasantly surprised by how it made my daily loop more fun.
…and then the XP multipliers stopped working.
The biggest mistake Funcom made with BP – and keeps making in general – is allowing their important updates to have shoddy quality.
No, I don’t expect a perfect or a zero-bug game. But we’re talking about things that are on critical path and affect their monetization. It’s just way too sloppy.
How would I feel? Unhappy, let down, and like I’ve been made a fool of. I can totally empathize and commiserate here.
But neither my feelings or their feelings are relevant here. Sure, it sucks, but I wish I could get a refund for every little thing that sucked in my life.
When stuff like this happens, you learn a hard lesson and try to apply it in the future. When you get misled or sold something defective, that is when you demand a refund.
And that is the hard lesson you learn from this.
Is it really a mistake? It’s additional revenue from people whose priorities differ from mine and yours. I don’t agree with how they spent their money, but I don’t think it’s a mistake to realize that people like that exist and are willing to give you money.
I don’t like the existence of premium BP, because it’s a symptom of a nasty practice in the game industry, the practice of deliberately crappifying your game loop just enough to get people to give your money to skip it.
But is it a mistake? No, I think it’s very deliberate.
Extrapolating from the past, I would guess that you’ll get the bacon long after you’ve forgotten the taste of the rest of the sandwich, and then you’ll get happy you got some nice bacon and say “finally, that’s the bacon I’ve been waiting for”, only to get half of it removed on the next update for balancing purposes 
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I’m not debating that time doesn’t have value, I’m just debating the fact that time spent in game should be something you pay to reduce. Ideally a player would want to play the game as much as they can. I get it some can’t and they want the rest of the stuff they pay for. I’m not going to debate that.
When there is aspects to a game that people are willing to pay to skip, the issue is you have content people don’t want to play through. Or worse you start preying on circumstances outside a player’s control. Either don’t and shouldn’t sit well with people.
I admit I might be a bit biased considering most of my days in video gaming were in an era where games succeeded or failed on the content they provided, and didn’t succeed on content they allowed you to skip.
Basically this.
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But you do realize how shady it was of Funcom to double the XP now right?
To reword my quote of you above,
“the XP bonus was an option for those who just couldnt be arsed enough to grind the challenges”
People paid ( yes willingly, no denying that) to advance the BP. We all know why, convenience, get it done quicker, some people did it because Funcom failed to say how long the BP would last etc. Now to find out that Funcom is basically giving everyone else a short cut because they are lazy?
I dont think people will ever get any compensation or refund, but at the end of the day we have to agree it was very shady and very ■■■■■■ of Funcom to do this.
Very good question, and Im betting the answer will be small. Funcom shot themselves in the foot by bringing in the double XP to help people finish. No one (except “whales” I think they were called) will every buy the premium ever again. They will just complain on the forums that they need more time until everyone gets the pass done in two days.
Um no.
The premium battle pass was offered to allow people to unlock the battle pass rewards with less effort.
It wouldn’t change how much or how little someone plays. All it would change is how much time they have to invest in the battle pass specifically. Specifically how much of someone’s time in game they spent to complete the uninspiring battle pass tasks.
No one was paying to play the game less, that’s an impressive leap of mental gymnastics you had to take to come to that conclusion.
About as shady as any other marketing stunt like that. “X isn’t selling enough? Put it on discount!”
Gotta love when someone slaps a judgment on a bunch of people because they didn’t care to play the game the same way you did 
Sure, maybe they were “lazy”. Or they didn’t care for the BP enough to finish it. Or some other reason.
Whatever the players’ reasons for not finishing the BP, Funcom said “hmmm, but we want a certain number of people to finish it” and decided to give them an incentive.
You know, people on these forums have been asking Funcom to make Conan Exiles F2P for a while now, especially given the BLB prices. I’m personally against that, because I think F2P games attract players that will make this game worse, but I’m starting to think it would be a whole lot of fun to see Funcom do that, and then watch everyone here lose their minds about how it’s “shady” for them to do so without giving a refund to those of us who paid the full price.
I’d wager that the answer was small before, too. The value of the premium BP was vanishingly small right from the start, and it’s mostly targeted at people who don’t mind spending real money on something with so little value.
You’re assuming that the BP challenges didn’t have any impact at all on how much time people would spend playing the game in general. I don’t think that’s a valid assumption.
When I started my battlepass, there was definitely days that I logged in just to utilize some of the boosts. So this is false.
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Its not that they discounted the Premium. Its that they increased the XP on the free side, nullifying the need for Premium. So basically, they got some “whales” to spend money, then when that slowed down, they made it so everyone could finish on time without it. Personally, it doesnt bother me, but I can see how and why people are upset.
Kinda like:
Sure, and they can. But how and when they did it seems very shady to me. Why didnt Funcom announce that each season of the pass would last for 90 days to begin with and make it well known, like with a timer on the Pass Page in game. Why did they wait till nearly then end of the time frame to increase the XP, nullifying the need for Premium? Surely their data would have shown a slow progression before now right?
I cant see them going free, and Im with you, I dont know that it would be beneficial. I draw comparison from another game I play that was paid to own, brought in micro transactions, then season passes, then went free to play, PUBG. Yes, completely different type of game, but from the monetization side, its relevant.
Pubg did very well introducing micro transactions to begin with, because people love skins, especially for their guns. It in turn created a market on steam for people to buy and sell them. I would hazard a guess to say that when the creators saw that not enough money was not being made, they added passes with items that are locked to your account, non tradable (kind of like our items here). When season passes were released, they did indeed have free stuff you could get, but you would get far more, and better items if you bought the pass. They had a timer of say “45 days left until season X ends”, so at least you knew how much time you had. After several seasons, their player count and revenue went downwards, and they made the game free.
Now its has exponentially more cheaters in it. Was that a slap in the face to those that paid for, and got a better game? Yeah, in a way I think it was. Did it bring more new players in? Yes. So I think you could say that there is pros and cons to going free, but from a gaming side of it, the cons likely outweigh the pros.
Yeah I think youre right here. Imagine how much smaller that percentage would be if they had a timer on the season, and told people that the last month would have double XP.
I just think that even when they hired a (whatever you want to call them) professional micro transaction specialist, they would do a better job at this. Season passes are not a new thing to games, Im lost at how they handled this one. In my mind, it was very very poorly, with the players definately not first on the priority list.
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Yep. They “discounted” the BP grind. They didn’t lower the price of anything, they just made something more easily accessible to more people… the same way a discount works.
“When that slowed down” sounds interesting. I’m not gonna bother asking for a source, because we both know it’s speculation. Worse, it’s speculation that makes no sense, because if getting closer to the end of BP should have an effect, it would be to increase the sales of premium BP, not decrease them.
So again, it’s people like you and @3LiON speculating to make things look “shady” because you want to.
I’m sorry, does “can’t be arsed to” mean something I didn’t know? I thought it meant “couldn’t be bothered”, which I thought would mean “they didn’t care about it enough”.
If I don’t care enough to wash my dishes right after eating, maybe it’s because I organize my time differently, or maybe I’m lazy.
They did:
Why indeed, when they could’ve let things as they are and rake in more money from people who are worried about the time pressure? Why not let the dreaded “FOMO” do its work?
It probably would have, and don’t call me Shirley 
And that’s why this decision is so intriguing. @Taemien has his theory why. I have mine. But it’s all speculation.
Kinda. On the one hand, it’s a pain to see a game you enjoyed go to the dogs. On the other hand, you (hopefully) derived enjoyment from it for years.
That’s kinda what I’m trying to say here: if Funcom ever makes Conan Exiles F2P, I’ll be upset that they ruined the game, but I’ll have had my fun with it for years and I would feel silly asking for a refund. Now, here’s where it gets interesting: what about people who only bought it a couple of weeks before it went F2P? Well, the unfortunate answer is “sucks to be them”.
As far as the timer goes, I’ll be honest: Funcom has eroded most of the trust I’ve been willing to give them, but even I don’t think that was intentional.
The XP boost is not something they could have announced beforehand, because believe it or not, you can’t actually know how many people will engage with your bright new idea before releasing it.
They did say they were going to tweak things as they go, too. What they could have done is explicitly say “hey, if things move too slow, we’ll give you guys a boost”, but even that is a double-edged blade. How many times have we seen people take that kind of verbiage as some kind of iron-clad promise? Imagine if things hadn’t worked out like this and more people had the BP nearly finished by now. You would still get a whole bunch of people claiming how they “broke their promise to give a boost” and how that’s unethical, and shady, and whatnot.
So no, I don’t think they could have announced the boost right from the start.
Funny thing is, had the timer been there, it would probably have driven up the sales of premium BP, until they announced the XP boost. And if you think a couple of voices currently complaining about “FOMO” have a point, that’s nothing compared to the shіtstorm that we would have seen if the BP page had a timer.
I wish I was surprised, but that’s what I’m talking about when I say they eroded my trust. I love this game, but it’s being produced by a highly dysfunctional company.
I’m actually amazed at how good some of their design decisions end up being.
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Then you were completing the battle pass and not playing the game. Re-read what I wrote.
Explain to me how to complete a Battlepass without playing the game?
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I would wager money that most people who spent money on the premium pass spent it early to get done. Thats not to say people wont to rush and get done, but lets be honest, would there be 1 in 10,000 that would spend money in the last month to finish the pass knowing they are getting 2x XP? Unlikely. So, using that idea is where I get that most people likely already spent money on the premium.
Shady is waiting until people have spent money on premium, then make the grind easier for those who cant finish.
Lets theorize something.
Scenario 1) They leave the XP rates alone and people dont finish the pass. Will those people buy another pass knowing they had difficulty finishing the first one? Maybe. Some might, some might not spend the money knowing its a loss. Betting more people wouldnt, then would.
Scenario 2) There is more people who bought the pass then the pass and a premium. Increase the rates to help more people finish, angering some who paid premium. Which side is more likely to buy another pass and spend money - the larger side that got some free help, or the few who spent money and felt robbed.
What they are doing makes sense - from a financial point of view. Thats all it is in the end, and its understandable too. You have to make money. Players just dont like to be played.
Must just be a difference in translation then.
See, without doing a bunch of digging in the forums or watching everything Funcom puts on video, I didnt see that. Due to reasons, I didnt watch the dev video on release, I prefer to see info in the forums. Call it my fault if you like, Id still like to see an in game timer going forward.
Yes, we all have speculations. With Funcoms lack of communications in the past, we will never know.
Very true, and I dont think they should have implimented it at all. I missed the first three weeks of the pass due to work, and I feared missing the end. I grinded it by playing maybe 3-4 hours a night for a week and got it done. Its very easily possible, and if anyone cared about their initial pass investment, playing for maybe 15-20 hours in 90 days shouldnt ever be an issue.
Yup I agree it would put them in a hard place. Thats why I feel they should have left season 1 alone, see how it did then make changes for season 2. The way it is now, I think alot of those who paid for premium will never pay again. They just lost that market.
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A) depends on your motivation. Difference between reading for pleasure and reading for work or school.
B) you took what I said out of context about the PREMIUM battle pass.
Whole post is about the purpose and benefit, or lack thereof, of the premium.
Oh, I agree with that. That’s what I speculated in an earlier post, too. I believe they’re giving the boost so that more people will feel comfortable with the BP. The more people feel that BP is hard to finish, the more they spread the word that BP isn’t worth buying.
All I’m saying is that I don’t think that’s “shady”, unless they had known from the beginning that they would do that. Is it a crappy thing to do to those who paid for the premium BP? Sure, it sucks. But was it premeditated dishonesty? No.
It wouldn’t be the first time I got in trouble for using a wrong word or an expression. I’ve done that even in my own native language 
Yeah, that’s why @Multigun’s recaps were such a treasure. Videos and streams are nice to watch when you have some time, but the information in them is neither discoverable nor searchable. And to be honest, it’s a little disappointing that they spent all these years relying on the effort from an unpaid enthusiast to make their information easily accessible to everyone 
At any rate, I agree that the BP should have had a visible in-game timer from the start.
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I don’t think that is always the case. The chores of the BP were stuff most of us did hundreds of times. We will keep doing them because they are necessary to the game. I think some people bought premium because they wanted the rewards asap. They didn’t want to wait. So, they bought Premium and they got the rewards they could have gotten in a few hours of a Single Player session with admin mode on for a lower price, if they were in such a hurry. I think this is why most people bought Premium, because it was obvious the BP was very easy to complete. Only someone with very little knowledge of the game would think it was hard to finish the BP. They wanted the rewards without the chores and didn’t want to wait.
So, they got what they paid for. I honestly don’t see the problem here. Funcom, realizing they might get frustrated might have a kind gesture towards those who offered them money, but they aren’t moraly obliged to do so in any way. It would be a courtesy, no more.
Orherwise, nobody will buy Premium again, not in the same molds. It simply isn’t worth it. Some people didn’t realize it soon enough…
why should they? it is a courtesy from funcom and they are not obliged to do so. the BP works as it was and, if you really want it, can easily be completed in the 90 days.
ah… the sweeping blow when you run out of arguments. this disqualifies you as a discussion partner. i’m out. my time is too valuable for that.
why? they announced exactly this before the start of the BP in case the number of completed BPs did not correspond to what they had envisaged. and now exactly this case has occurred and now it is shady? i don’t understand it… sorry.
they announce it. they meet the buyers and then it is shady… 
yes, i can see that too and i would also be upset, but at myself, if i had spent money without informing myself beforehand for what and what other conditions are involved. stuff like the announcement that there will be extra XP if the number of completed BPs towards the end of the BP does not meet funcom’s expectations.
could this information be easier to find? definitely. funcom still has a lot of potential for improvement in this area.
can the information be found with a little effort? definitely, and if my money isn’t worth this effort, then I can’t blame others for my own laziness.
both the ~90 day duration of the BP and the configurability of the XP bonuses provided by funcom are no secret and have been repeated several times by funcom as well as many content creators. you can find this information if you want to and when it comes to money you should want to. but if you’re not interested then there’s no reason to complain afterwards.
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I have now read through all the statements here.
And I come to the conclusion that there is more emotion flowing here than logic.
@CodeMage and @Testerle are exempt from this, their statements are well founded and I can only agree with them.
No tricks were applied to the BP, the Premium BP is also not a trick.
Anyone who buys the Premium BP has decided not to play the game and thus the challenges properly.
(So a refund is not acceptable)
The bazaar is really a FOMO thing that involves tricks.
I’m playing on a server with someone who buys everything. (Because she can)
And she says herself that the bazaar is far too expensive for someone who doesn’t care about spending money, that you are still tempted to spend money on certain items because subliminally it is suggested that it would be a great thing.
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You do remember how the forum members helped in the feedback they needed?
We are equally responsible! All we do constantly is fight each other and filling threads with fights for things they don’t belong to us!
@erjoh topic about battle pass and bazzar have over 1k replies!
90% in it, is fights between members again!
That’s why we end up the last to be noticed! We push them away from their own living room!
My last contribution here!
As a costumer I felt a bit insulted with the bazzar, I would love to have more clarity in the next one if possible! Plus 9 would like to buy more on my purchase, I think what is sold is a bit pricey!
If possible, it’s not a demand. I can always not buy!
For the premium battle pass I didn’t buy it, so I don’t know and cannot understand how op feels. Because of that I respect his feelings and accept them as feedback!
That’s all, love you all!
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The only thing I dislike about the bazaar is having to wait for it to “resupply”. When I started playing again I only had the sandstone set 2 available. I also want the 1st set! Who knows when it will be available now… 