Bow damage is too high

Yeah, who knows. Maybe the game has too much armor pen on almost every mid to top weapon out there making all “more armor” gear variants useless simply because that armor is ignored by the system.

Then you stack every possible armor pen perk from agility on top of that and “for some reason” medium and heavy become worse than light armor.

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Stagger is almost non existent all ready. But sure make stagger longer on light and medium than heavy, and keep the current stagger on the heavy armor and increase it on the light and medium. But that still wont make heavy more viable. Back in the days when all armors had same stam regenration, I found it more viable to use heavy armor. Even liked the “side step” dodge more than the current one. It had something now everything just is the same. Just less rolls.

There you go, I didnt even know it was that close. But yea there the “use heavy” believers got there answers aswell :rofl:

You mean that medium armor does less protection than light? Yeah something is definitely wrong with the values there but there is a larger point sirdave is correct in…at the epic scale, the differences in armor are negligible with about 10% damage reduction between the levels. This is because the of the curve mellows out and we get meh increases in armor. They tried to correct this by altering the equation but it’s still out of sync once it gets past 50% DR. Around 300 armor is where the DR (40%) starts going to the crapper per armor. By 50%, it’s a much slower rate and gets worse with each point.

I believe the fix isn’t to touch bows but to redo armor because most of us sit at epic gear. Armor needs to provide real advantages with each type to promote various play styles. 10% between light, medium, and heavy armors just isn’t cutting it.

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Have in mind. Killing a naked needs roughly 2 hits less than killing someone with epic light armor. Something is rly wrong with the armor values x)

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Oh yes… casual 75% armor penetration :man_shrugging: nothing special :slight_smile:

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Just like that, nothing more than a butter knife

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I found that the fencer modification works wonders on the katana. I hardly 3ven use heavy attacks with it and so adding 10 points to the light attacks is nice and I still use the special to get past enemies when cornered.

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Haven’t tried the fencer fitting on a katana yet, may have to give it a shot.

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On EL, everyone uses Khari Bow.

What is the problem? Nothing special.

The problem is the buggy rolling thrust as you put it… since it adds 25% armor penetration on top of already getting 10% from carrying a lighter loadout…
So that’s 35% just from perks (which imo should only ever apply to Agility-only melee weapons)
On top of that you get 40% from the bow + arrow combo…

I am simply explaining why medium / heavy armor didn’t change much… since the armor penetration you get is ignoring most of it due to weird buggy perks etc, not to mention the change to armor penetration with 3.0 where it becomes less effective against lighter armor.

In any case, a lot of the issues seem to lead back to the attribute system and very often to this one rolling thrust perk primarily, though others have similar issues as well.

Yeah, Agility is OP.

Stamina, Weapon Damage, Act after Dodging and then the perks.

Though I am still smiling about theoretical responses like the following. People don’t play PvP and do silly responses with no data backing them up on PvP threads. Just hilarious.

“Just use medium or heavy armor.”

:joy: :joy: :joy:

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Your own evidence actually suggests they need to either dramatically lower light armor damage reduction or significantly boost the other two.

Why shouldn’t it be a choice of dying in two hits but maintaining mobility or being slower but surviving 6-10 hits?(made up numbers for illustration)

I mean, it’s a logical thing to jump to imo, but they more than likely didn’t account for this high of an armor penetration value from a bow shot. It does render the normal mechanics that you’d expect… quite useless… :slight_smile:
I’m not even sure Funcom went and did a field test on this and looking at the whole picture other than the initial theoretical brainstorming when they came up with the perks.

That’s why I said it’s not the weapon’s fault :stuck_out_tongue: the perks that enable it to be this OP and rendering armor and other counter-mechanics close to useless… there really should be some form of balancing and limitation of the cross-effects of these perks… and they could very easily be limited to PvP-only as well… so idk what they’re doing :man_shrugging:

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If you haven’t realized, bows can have 75% AP.

Basically ignoring any armor.

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I highly doubt Funcom testers/devs are able to figure out how OP rolling thrust is and start to abuse it with specific weapons. (Greataxe too cough)

They simply do not play their game intensively enough to understand the impact of such mechanics.

This is why PvP games like Dota or League have gameplay analysts, that collect data of pro matches and send this to the game designers.

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But that is an issue not with bows but how AP is significantly OP than DR. DR is a limiting equation that self limits the more you go up it, while AP is just simple subtraction from that DR which is utter BS nonsense. AP needs to be redefined as armor value reduction vs direct DR affects. On top of that the equation of DR needs to show more delineation between the armor types. Perhaps a flat out DR value added to the type…like 1% DR for each type for light armor giving +5% total, 3% for medium giving +15% total and 5% for heavy giving+25% total. That would mean heavy WILL stop your one shot and provides value to seriously contemplate the reduction in stamina.

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:wink: but way easier to avoid hits from also only deals broken dmg when having berserker and even more with madberserker. I think most of the problems is connected with the perks.

I think they havent tested some or them at all. Or im sure they havent tested last stand, and such in real situations. Because if they did they would never place it in game. Think it’s the same with more.

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Agree with this.

I’d say remove damage reduction from the equation and have AP reduce your armor value, similar to Sunder.

So high AP values do what the name says “ARMOR PENETRATION”. The more armor you have, the more it gets penetrated.

Then have specific damage multipliers on weapons against different armor tiers.

1.5 for light,
1.25 for medium,
1.00 for heavy.

OR

Have armor rating affect your damage.

Fine tune the system and it actually gets interesting

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And I laugh at people who think fighting in a box in a staged video is PVP. I find it ironic you claim what we’ve said as theoretical but are using some theoretical set of circumstances lined up in an unrealistically perfect way to prove a point.

But this has been my point since the beginning. You’re not going to get those perfect rolling sniper shots unless you’re in a flat premade little dojo with players instructed to take the hit.

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