I’d say that if they plan to stick to their guns on this matter, the torches SHOULD be an exception. No ifs, ands, or buts. It offers no major combat advantages and will allow players at least one QOL feature in this whole debacle no one asked for.
Is this just your own intuition, or did they actually say something to that effect?
I really hope this is not true. The RNG grind for a lot of these is absolutely loathsome, and making them unrepairable is just adding insult to injury. Fortunately, both the insult and the injury can be ignored if the craftable alternatives are either on par or superior (or even slightly inferior).
If they make legendaries much better, then they’re doubling down on the slot machine mechanics, which is frankly one of the worst aspects of this whole game.
Got bad news there:
Wait, I thought they were repairable, but at the cost of losing a bit of max durability. So they aren’t repairable at all? Tf???
It’s something they said and also something that seems true based on the pictures I’m seeing from the beta. So yes, legendaries will be the absolute best weapons, better than crafted epics.
Things like these:
I’m not a fan of it either for the opposite reason
You know how all the knowledge tiers were pretty much useless aside from the higher tier ones like star metal and obsidian, because you just leveled so fast and bought these things with coins etc that everyone skipped iron / steel / hardened steel tiers completely…
I’m not saying it’s a good thing, but up to now at least if you wanted the “best” weapons, you at least had to get max level, learn those skills and get a bladesmith or something…
Now… however… you grab your stone daggers at level 5, solo a silly overgrown lizard (btw world bosses have half HP… so that makes it easier) and poof, you have endgame weapons… no point in unlocking any weapon…
I am really really not a fan of the way they’ve been destroying early game one change after another, it’s basically making all the knowledge unlocks that are supposed to give you some joy… completely redundant…
They’re taking away so much from the game with these changes that if they keep this direction… we might as well just spawn at level 60 and they can remove all the silly iron and steel weapons
Very particular inquiry.
This one won’t have access to the test servers again for several more days (otherwise this one would test themselves) and wonders, with the equipment durability nerf, will a single set of stone daggers be enough to solo the croc?
Yes, they are very easy to make, so, if it does take several sets, about how many need to be in radial window/hot bar?
I for one agree with you @RedLynx23. At this point in time I am refraining from commenting on too many changes in the beta. But while I applaud the initiative to enhance Legendary weapons and make them the top tier again, I do hold some concerns. Look even with the increases in durability, I am opposed to Legendary items as a whole being made ethereal (unrepairable). And even more so items such as the Final Breath of the Red Mother which can not confer unfair advantage or create imbalance. In the case of items such as the Final Breath of the Red Mother and the Sword of Crom I spent, literally, over 5 months trying to grind the later and closer to 12 months for the prior. This change devalues the work and time investment of players, and is an uneccessary change. And I would politely urge our devs to reconsider this change.
See, this is precisely the argument I never really agreed with. I call it the Schrödinger’s Noob, because if you’re a veteran Conan Exiles player starting from scratch again, you don’t really get excited about unlocking early game tiers again – been there, done that – but if you’re a newbie who gets excited about that stuff, you don’t really get to beat the world boss at level 5 with stone daggers
I’m totally fine with being able to grab end-game weapons before you’re level 60, because I’ve always seen leveling in Conan Exiles as a teaching tool rather than the MMORPG mechanic of level-gating the stuff you’re allowed to use (in order to artificially pad your engagement with the game).
What I’m not fine with is making us depend on repeated RNG grind for access to the best-in-game gear.
And that really makes me question whether the team has a coherent vision and direction or not. For a while, their decisions have been consistently moving away from slot-machine mechanics, and I was very happy with that. Now we’re seeing a complete reversal in direction, and I’m wondering what the hell is going on.
Honestly, Den or whoever’s in charge, pick a direction and stick with it long enough to let me decide whether to stick with this game or finally free up a chunk of my free time, but don’t keep yanking me around.
Rare torches like these should be repairable with a legendary weapon repair kit (even if it doesn’t currently).
I hate perma damage. And I hate grinding for the same thing over and over because of perma damage.
I have these torches, but I rarely use them, didn’t have to repair them yet… so if this isn’t possible it really sucks.
Torches can be considered weapons since you can deal damage.
Maybe you don’t I do… early game is actually the part I enjoy most in this game which is why I generally play at very reduced 0.1x-0.2x rates. And generally once I leveled up, did every dungeon, built up a T3 base and got all the thralls I wanted I simply restart the game.
As such I would get excited about all those unlocks, but I can’t… because even if I try to avoid them, eventually I end up with a legendary here and there and then it just feels stupid keeping that in a box and using iron weapons it’s already there…
I’m not… again… I completely avoided the khitan caravans as much as I could… currently in my new playthrough my character is level 13… has like 300 obolus and using iron weapons and iron tools.
I enjoy progression in this game, and these types of changes take exactly that angle of the game away…
Now, while I CAN mod these for myself if needed… but I prefer to play the game close to vanilla and only using the built in server slider to reduce XP - being the only “content” change… and I am also sure there are plenty of other players out there who also enjoy a slower leveling and the sense of progression.
I think you’re falling into the “boredom trap”… you have been playing for a while so you look at leveling as something you’re bored with not really being able to look at it objectively. When’s the last time you actually leveled a new character? The issue of fast progression and skipping over most content is one that equally plagues new players… the game simply does not make sense from 1-60
When’s the last time you unlocked and crafted a Studded Iron Mace? or a Cimmerian Battle-Axe?
I agree with you though that it shouldn’t go into straight up RPG territory and level gate stuff… but it would be nice to keep at least some sense of progression within the knowledge system so 90% of the weapon unlocks aren’t redundant.
As for the RNG, truth is, there’s not much to do for a lot of people endgame, so it makes sense why they picked that angle for a lot of things, but I agree it’s a bit cheap. Who knows, maybe in a few “Ages” they add enough additional content to where they can eliminate RNG for the most part
Right now though I think they’re afraid to remove that as it really wouldn’t leave much PvE content in the game… You can do every dungeon in a single afternoon building can only go so far for some (In my case I generally farm and build up a normal sized T3 house ).
In my last play I probably spent most of my time hunting thralls like bladesmiths, bowmakers and shieldwrights and I did get them all eventually, in my new one I already have all of those even though I’m level 13
Anyway, this is all kinda off-topic I guess, not much to do with torches.
I stand corrected, it seems that there are people who enjoy this aspect.
I don’t mean to imply anything negative with this observation, but it would seem to me that you’re trying to play Conan Exiles as an MMO(RPG?).
Oh, I’ve had this opinion for years now. I think the first time I put it in writing was when Funcom removed the level 60 requirement for the skeleton key chests and people started complaining about it.
It’s not boredom, really. I actually enjoy starting from scratch, but unlike you, my focus is on seeing how much I can streamline the process of getting established. Leveling is part of that process, but not all of it.
Months ago, while the old journeys were still a thing, but the Khitan caravans were already there. I am kinda looking forward to starting from scratch with the new journeys and seeing what that’s like.
I make a new character at least once a year. I would do it more often if I didn’t have to do the whole stupid “run around killing NPCs until the T4 Falafel Engineer spawns” thing and the whole stupid “keep whacking the same monster until it drops the Sacred Axe of Smelly Cheese” thing.
I’ve never really understood why people keep saying that. There’s a fuсkton of stuff to do in this game, and True Newbs need something to guide them and teach them what they can do and how to do it. I’ve always found the leveling system to be a pretty decent tool for that purpose.
I’m not sure about the mace. My use of maces is limited in general. But Cimmerian Battle-Axe is the thing I craft and use on every single character, because one-handed axes are my weapon of preference
RNG-gating is pretty much the cheapest way to encourage engagement. Even level-gating the content requires more game design effort.
RNG is a useful tool in the game designer’s toolbox, but Funcom tends to use it a the golden hammer.
I can understand being able to remove it. What I don’t understand is the yo-yo approach. If you look at the initial release in 2018 as the baseline, they started leaning more and more on RNG when they revamped Unnamed City and introduced the Library of Esoteric Artifacts. They continued in that vein for a while, culminating with the RNG dumpster fire that was the Siptah early access. Then they started moving away from the RNG-Gate Everything approach, the first step being the revamping of the crafting stations. They kept going in that direction with Khitan camps and similar. Now they’re doing a U-turn again, and I’m getting whiplash.
You know what could help with that? Introducing mechanics that empower PVE players to get creative and produce content for other players. Right now, most of the stuff PVE and PVE-C players build is purely decorative stuff to show off to other players
This creates a bunch of problems. People go overboard and then they get bored and turn into serial refreshers, then new players come in and do that whole thing again, until the server is overbuilt and suffering from performance problems, and then someone inevitably says “enough is enough” and reports some of the more insane crap, and then the wiped and suspended players come here to complain.
Wouldn’t it be better if we could build more stuff that actually serves a purpose and other players could interact with it? Right now, the only things you can build for other players are map rooms, transportory stones, storm shelters, and arenas. Oh, and roads and bridges, but those are a no-no.
Other than those and actual bases (to live in and store your stuff), everything else PVE players build are just theme parks. Funcom should really roll up their sleeves and do some actual game design to help people play together.
It’s kinda off-topic, but it’s still related. There are reasons behind Funcom’s decision to screw up the torches, and those underlying reasons are the stuff we’ve been discussing here.
But yeah, maybe we should stop
People wanted their legendaries to be legendary. So they’re getting what they want. Even if it is as easy as stabbing an oversized croc with stone shards for the better part of five minutes.
Pretty much the reason why I kept pushing back every time people complained about legendaries not being legendary enough. Occasionally even I get the opportunity to say “told you the f*ck so”.
Making them not repairable… doesn’t make them Legendary thou.
It make them toss away items, you’ll never want to use… or lose cause of rare Drop Rates.
I start game over alot… I find it fun, as end game is pretty boring. (Grind for good-fun weapons, that never drop… isn’t Fun.
Now they’ll break… /SARCASM ON! YAYS! /SARCASM OFF!
I find leveling up, and happening upon a good one, and keeping it with me fun. It Earns its Legendary Status as your weapon…
I feel like I’m gonna have go back to Using Admin Panel over and over to fix the game…
I RARELY use Admin panel now, cause game has a decent balance now (SP Wise) Kits aren’t super hard to get, Good spot for weapons you can maintain them.
Low Health one bugs me abit to… there already pretty Squishy… If your rocking on level gear, there abit tougher. Some of Damage later ones do is already out of hand for Light Armor user in general.
Feel like another middle finger for light armor users.
And some of enemies do have abit to much health, even if your maxed out in stat, with end game weapon.
Stam Increase… I don’t know why. I can go outside with several of my swords, and take swing at Melons… I can’t picture how making your swing set more limited is making it better.
I get gameplay wise your doing something for balance/unbalance. Already pretty good balance as it is, Why mess with it… I can’t picture it.
I get PVP has some major in-balance and its on going since beta… PVE is in a good spot for alot of things.
Not looking forward to some of changes. Some of them, feel like “change it cause, change it for lolz”
Some of these changes don’t make me wanna play. They even stated they have more players now
Why risk that…
Is this thread evolving into a general discussion of the new legendary status bells and whistles or is it still about two specific torches?
Depends on the consensus, I guess? If people think we should STFU about legendaries in general (or Funcom’s game design vision or lack of thereof), then I guess it isn’t
For legendaries in general, I want to refer back to @Croms_Faithful’s suggestion that different legendaries come from different biomes. Since we cannot repair the weapons at all anymore, I think it would make sense that the general legendaries that come from chests should have a limited biome where they can be found, thus decreasing the RNG aspect, at least by a bit.
But I do agree that the torches should be an exception. I don’t have either of them myself but I can’t see the harm in either making these repairable or making them last eternally and just removing durability from these two items.
What I would do is do away with the RNG skeleton chest legendaries… as in, put something else in those boxes I’m sure there’s plenty of fun things we could have in those
Then I’d put those new legendaries as dungeon loot, the better ones in the harder dungeons… I know that this might sound too RPG-ish to you… but I think it’s still better than RNG and solves the issue I presented above as well.
Nah, it’s not too RPG-ish at all. I don’t mind “natural” or “organic” progression, or whatever you wanna call the progression that comes from getting better at playing. What I think is RPG-ish is when you start to gate the progression behind one or more numbers, or something equally artificial.
I realize that this might sound vague, or maybe like a distinction without a difference, so I’ll try to illustrate with an example, but bear in mind that it’s not a proposal, it’s just a thought experiment.
Imagine if Reptilian armor gave you some sort of resistance to Thag’s AoE attack. That would establish natural progression of beating the Dregs before you try the Wine Cellar. Now imagine if you couldn’t enter Dregs before you were level 20 and you couldn’t enter Wine Cellar before you were level 55.
Now, in both cases, the desired outcome is to go to Dregs before going to the Wine Cellar. But the latter approach tries to force you. In both cases you could skip going to the Dregs altogether, but if you decide to do both, the latter approach makes it impossible to order them the way you like, whereas the former gives you the freedom to do it any way you want if you’re skillful enough at playing the game.
So no, I don’t think what you proposed is to RPG-ish. However, it does sound like replacing one RNG with another, more onerous one.
If I want to try to get a Lovetap, I can run around the map killing world bosses and opening chests until it drops or I get bored. (I don’t really do that, instead I kill bosses and collect keys and then later just go on a run to “cash them in”, but it’s the same principle.) Whereas if I want the Khari Raider recipe, I have to go through the whole Wine Cellar dungeon and hope that I’m not gonna get 5th f*cking Khari Weaponry recipe in the row. And if it’s Khari Weaponry again, I gotta wait for the respawn.
I wouldn’t mind having legendaries drop in the dungeons if I had a good way to influence the outcome. Like I keep proposing, let the dungeons drop special crafting components, each of which can be used to craft more than one kind of legendary, and then we take those components to a place where the final product can be crafted. You can still control the RNG drop rate of those components, but at least the players have some degree of choice over what they’re getting from the dungeons instead of praying for that one specific drop.
On our Savage Wilds map, the admin set up a vendor that buys back extra pages from (what is essentially) the Voidforge/Esoteric Library. And then that vendor sells fragments of power. You need to sell back 3 pages to get a fragment of power but it at least gives you something to do with the extras and, if you’re super unlucky, you will get another shot. If Pippi would let us, we’d skip the Pippi coin intermediate step but it’s the best we’ve got at the moment. Wish there was something like this within the game itself, even if it’s not 1:1 for copies.
Wholeheartedly agree… either change their rarity so they can be repaired, or make them permanent if there is no other solution. Unless the motivation here is to deter people from the time sink involved in farming for a torch. A server full of people trying to constantly farm the same uber rare drops is going to be incredibly frustrating and not fun for most.