Bow AP still have no effect

Simple test 2 bows, add AP oil for one and blank for other. = same damage

When this bug will be fixed? I reporting it since may i think…

4 Likes

but don’t u just love all the new arrows from the last patch enough to overlook this?

Bleeding arrows is good, but they are low on damage, so i find them balanced with regular. But still. This is a bug and there should not be any overlook here …ALL BUGS MUST BE FIXED

1 Like

I remembered his first write up, nice. He’s probably correct and this has been ignored since math is hard.
And I was being sarcastic @UnknowmMantra ur right it is insulting that archery is so poorly thought of that nobody cares to balance it by making the basics like damage and AP calculations work properly, yet we get cool new arrows!!

1 Like

The problem, that AP on bows is just out of formula. For melee everything is ok, working and increasing damage, but for range weapon is not. AP comming only from ARROWS… But lvl40 perk add 30% AP and it works for bows aswell. Ofc i tested damage and AP from bows with 0 acc and 40 acc. No differance. Voice of Derketo has 0 AP and deal same damage as any other bow with 28 damage and 10, 20 or 60 AP

1 Like

The problem with AP and arrows is, from WHAT source should it count?

You already have 100% AP arrows in the game:
https://conanexiles.gamepedia.com/Mandibles_of_Atlach-Nacha

And with Reach of the Red-Mother, which has 30% AP, you have 130% AP?

Edit: And seeing Unknownmantras reply, that you also get AP from 40acc… SO 40acc gives you 30%, with red-mother which has also 30% you are at 60%.
Put the oil of penetration on the bow and you have currently 70%, with 40acc you are at 100% AP.

And then you use 100% AP arrows :smiley: :smiley:

So which sources counts? Which source overwrites the other and completely removes the AP value? questions about questions :slight_smile:

Coz boz has AP, it should be Bow+Arrows, or Bows should has no AP, but legendary bows and some craft bows have differance in AP.

if AP > 100% AP = 100%, it has no effect. Tested with melee weapons.

Red Mother bow is most hard to get. Voice of Dekreto is a best one. 28 Damage +5 ACC 0 AP, easy to get. Legendary bows +5 acc has abit less damage + 15-20 AP, but reason to have AP if it has 0 effect?

About 100 AP arrows - they are useless. Nobody, almost, is not running around in heavy. Only in Light with low Armor, Serpent man arrow will deal more damage than 100 AP Arrows

1 Like

@zerog

SinglePlayer TestLive. Official Settings: x1
Test Subject: Relic_Hunter_Archer_4_Hyborian - 825 HP
Attributes: 0

Attack: A single light attack x 3:

  1. Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 766-766-766/825
  2. Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage) + Flinthead Arrow (6 damage) - 790-790-790/825
  3. Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 777-777-777/825
  4. Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base) + Flinthead Arrow (6 damage) - 800-800-800/825

Attack: A single heavy attack x 3:

  1. Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 697-697-697/825
  2. Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage) + Flinthead Arrow (6 damage) - 748-748-748/825
  3. Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 719-719-719/825
  4. Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base) + Flinthead Arrow (6 damage) - 771-771-771/825

+++++++

Tltr: It appears from the test that bow’s sheet damage does affect the damage inflicted on the target.

  • Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 766/825 (59 damage on target) vs
  • Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base) + Quivering Arrow (40 damage) - 777/825 (48 damage on target)
4 Likes

Strange test. What was you testing? If you was testing AP on bows, why not use oil of AP?

And as i noticed damage on thralls and damage test on players will have different results…

Oil of Agony and gives 15 flat sheet damage:
Reach of the Red Mother (30 damage base)
Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Agony (45 damage)

Same bow, same armor penetration, same arrows, same target:
30 damage bow = 49 damage to the target
45 damage bow = 59 damage to the target

Hope it is clearer now.

P.S. Considering that there is no pvp/pve damage split (thus all the balance troubles), I doubt the result will be much different but feel free to repeat it with a buddy. I have no means to perform this test on another player.

Oil of Agony is DMG modifier right. so the DMG modifier does work on bows from your test.

Correct. The Oil of Agony gives +15 sheet damage on the bow from 30 dmg to 45 dmg. The dmg on the bow does seem to affect the dmg inflicted on the target (at least in my pve test).

  • Oil of Penetration – Increases weapon armor penetration

But does this even work with bows?

No. Only damage work. As @Narelle tested, with DAMAGE OIL not AP oil, damage increase add pure damage to bow, AP has no Effect.

P.s. @Narelle, AP Oil provide +40 AP…+40 AP from oil +30 AP from 40 ACC +~20 AP from Arrows + Bow AP should provide >100 AP = 100AP, but if you will test it damage will be like it only 17 AP from arrows…

@Narelle

The “Weapon Oils” feat can be purchased from the Archivist in the Unnamed City for 5 Fragments of Power. Oils are crafted at the Firebowl Cauldron. Only one can be active at a time.

Oil of Agony – Increases weapon damage by a flat amount (15).
Oil of Penetration – Increases weapon armor penetration

Agony +15 DAMAGE
Penetration +40 AP

Oh, sorry. Misunderstood your thread. I am used to ap meaning attack points i.e damage.

So what you are trying to say is that the armor penetration doesn’t work not the damage. I will test the armor penetration when I have a moment and report back. Amended my replies to read damage instead of ap to avoid further confusion.

4 Likes

Here is the new test on armor penetration this time:

SinglePlayer TestLive. Official Settings: x1
Test Subject: Votaries_Fighter_4b (Spinas) - 825 HP
Attributes: 0

Attack: A single light attack:

Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Penetration (30 dmg + 70% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Penetration (30 dmg + 70% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 812/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Spiked Weapon Fitting (30 dmg + 45% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Spiked Weapon Fitting (30 dmg + 45% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 812/825
Reach of the Red Mother (30 dmg + 30% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825
Reach of the Red Mother (30 dmg + 30% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 812/825

Hollowbone Bow (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 9% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 798/825
Hollowbone Bow (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 9% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 812/825
Derketo’s Voice (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 0% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 798/825
Derketo’s Voice (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 0% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 812/825

Frostshot (22 dmg + 9% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 802/825
Epic Flawless Bossonian Bow (22 dmg + 8% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 802/825

Attack: A single heavy attack:

Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Penetration (30 dmg + 70% armor penetration) + (18% armor penetration) - 769/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Penetration (30 dmg + 70% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (16% armor penetration) - 798/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Spiked Weapon Fitting (30 dmg + 45% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (18% armor penetration) - 769/825
Reach of the Red Mother + Spiked Weapon Fitting (30 dmg + 45% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (16% armor penetration) - 798/825
Reach of the Red Mother (30 dmg + 30% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (18% armor penetration) - 769/825
Reach of the Red Mother (30 dmg + 30% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (16% armor penetration) - 798/825

Hollowbone Bow (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 9% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 765/825
Hollowbone Bow (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 9% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 797/825
Derketo’s Voice (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 0% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 765/825
Derketo’s Voice (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 0% armor penetration) + Flinthead Arrow (6 dmg + 16% armor penetration) - 797/825

Frostshot (22 dmg + 9% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 775/825
Epic Flawless BBossonian Bow (22 dmg + 8% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 775/825

++++++++++

Tltr:
As @UnknowmMantra reported, it appears that the armor penetration indeed does not affect the bow damage dealt on the target when being modified:

  • Reach of the Red Mother + Oil of Penetration (30 dmg + 70% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825

  • Reach of the Red Mother + Spiked Weapon Fitting (30 dmg + 45% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825

  • Reach of the Red Mother (30 dmg + 30% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 799/825

  • Hollowbone Bow (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 9% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 765/825

  • Derketo’s Voice (28 dmg + 5 accuracy + 0% armor penetration) + Quivering Arrow (40 dmg + 18% armor penetration) - 765/825

@Ignasis If the test is any helpful to the team, feel free to pass it to them. Thank you!
The oil / spiked fitting don’t seem to affect the bow damage at all neither does the base armor penetration.

7 Likes

Further to the above findings:
You still can’t drag any arrows on the Hollowbone Bow (you can equip them from the hotbar).

4 Likes

Personally, I think AP should not be tied to bows in any way. It really should be the arrows only. However, that would be a big limiter for archery. So for balance between archery and other weapon types, it is probably much easier to make AP ONLY work on bows and not arrows. No other weapon uses two pieces, each having their own combat stats.

I suppose you could go so far as to make arrows and bows each have their own enhancements, where arrows stats matter when target is at a distance, but in melee range, the bow stats matter, as you are whacking the enemy in the face and nutz with your bow, because they are too close to shoot. I’ve seen other games where the archery animations switched to close combat moves and really liked it.

Seeing which steps Funcom takes with the latest patches, I wouldnt even wonder when they remove AP completely on bows…

They are making many changes where the playerbase get upset, but for what? To make the game die faster?
You cannot mod the Red Mother or Glowing torch with modkits anymore. Why??