The Kinscourge's hp doubled instead of reduced

[Lyston]

Basic Info:

Platform: Steam
Issue Type: Gameplay
Game Mode: Single Player
Server Type: PvE
Map: Exiled Lands
Mods: none

---

Bug Description:

The patch notes mention that 3-skull bosses have had their hp reduced, “in general expect shorter but deadlier fights.” However, the 3-skull boss “The Kinscourge” has had his hp increased by double instead of reduced (from 7,219 to 14,560). Other bosses may also have this issue.

---

Bug Reproduction:

Go to the boss or spawn him via the admin panel.

For the sake of this bug report, I have gone into (unmodded) Live version and recorded the hp values of several bosses, and done the same with the Age of War beta to compare the difference.

The patch notes say:

@Ignasi

Animals and monsters are now generally speaking more deadly but have significantly less health, making dodging and blocking more important in combat. Humans (including thralls) have had their health reduced, but still vary in threat level between tribes as before.

• Alpha animals (1 skull) are now much closer to the strength of their animal type
• Champions (2 skulls) can now be found among the tribes and drop Unique items (see above)
• World bosses (3 skulls) have been adjusted similarly to other enemies but the exact adjustments vary - in general expect shorter but deadlier fights

So far, the beta has proven this is almost always true. Enemies have their hp reduced between -40% to -60%. The first exception I found was The Kinscourge, who instead of less hp now had the highest hp I’d seen across the entire beta. This didn’t seem right for a boss that isn’t even end-game, so I looked at a variety of bosses.

The following is a comparison of Live → AoW bosses I tested. This list is not exhaustive of all bosses in the game.

Bosses

• Legendary - Giant Crocodile: 12,160 → 5,629 (-54%)
• Dregs - Abysmal Remnant: 2,348 → 4,890 (+108%)
• Witch Queen - Witch Queen: 4,500 → 2,250 (-50%)
• Barrow King - The King Beneath: 4,213 → 1,109 (-74%)
• Sinkhole - Undead Dragon: 14,582 → 8,265 (-43%)
• Black Keep - The Kinscourge: 7,219 → 14,560 (+102%)
• Well - The Degenerate: 1,287 → 3,740 (+191%)
• Unnamed - Guardian of the Flame: 14,867 → 4,940 (-67%)
• Unnamed - Red Mother: 18,717 → 8,265 (-56%)
• Warmaker’s - Arena Champion: 5,250 → 2,625 (-50%)
• Warmaker’s - Champion of the Warmaker: 17,000 → 24,500 (+44%)

I’m not sure if there was meant to be an attempt at rebalancing here, but the inconsistency leads me to believe this is in error. For example, the low-level noob river boss Abysmal Remnant is now even harder for noobs to kill, but the much higher level Mounds boss The King Beneath has been reduced down to the lowest hp boss in the game. The formerly easiest boss, the weak little Degenerate in the Well, has now been buffed by almost triple his prior hp. Within the brutal Warmaker’s Sanctum, Arena Champion appropriately had her hp reduced, but the Champion of the Warmaker had his hp buffed by half.

Since this update includes such sweeping changes touching upon all the enemies in the game, I feel there are bound to be enemies that slipped through the cracks and had the wrong values put in for the update. I hope this post drags attention to some of them and leads to another look at some that truly don’t make sense. The idea behind this update was “expect shorter but deadlier fights” but in these cases we have some that become brutally longer fights, much more of a drag to finish and the opposite of the goal here.

Below is a quick screenshot comparison of the Live and Beta Kinscourge.

Live:

Beta:

[forkyeah]

I think this is not a bug and was intentional. The kinscourge is not an open world boss but a dungeon boss and some other dungeon bosses have had their health increased to encourage grouping up.

[GodlyVoice]

It might also be related to their drops, which could be more valuable.

[MarcosC]

I think I read the Teliths weapons were nerfed… doesn’t make much sense making the boss that you need to kill to craft them harder. Nobody will want them unless if they want to apply illusion based on them on other swords…
Anyway, he’s an easy kill, double hp or not. He should be much harder. And the weapons should be much better…

[GodlyVoice]

@MarcosC

doesn’t make much sense making the boss that you need to kill to craft them harder

@MarcosC

He should be much harder.

This killed me.

[MarcosC]

IF the weapons were much better or, at least, as good as they are pre AoW.
You understood what I mean, @GodlyVoice !

[Xevyr]

@Lyston

However, the 3-skull boss “The Kinscourge” has had his hp increased

The Kinscourge actually needed more HP… his moveset and abilities are very decent, the problem with him is that he just dies way too fast and doesn’t get to use most of them… so that’s not a bad change and it won’t just prolong a boring fight like you have with regular world bosses.

@Lyston

The formerly easiest boss, the weak little Degenerate in the Well, has now been buffed by almost triple his prior hp.

It’s funny that you tested the Degenerate and bring it up as being some sort of an issue…
You do realize the boss is scripted to auto-die as soon as you spent a bit of time killing the ghosts that appear? You never actually had to hit or damage this boss at all… he stands up… he’s been sitting for centuries… his blood clot goes to his brain or something and dies of a stroke
As such, his HP is absolutely irrelevant. (however the Degenerate was using the same template as the sword wielding Serpentmen so the change was most likely aimed at those)

---

Now… initially I thought that maybe this could have been unintended since the health data of things is often stored across various stacking templates so there’s always a chance to affect other things, however… that’s typically only the case for humanoids. (So the witch queen and arena champion would fall into this category)
All the other bosses you listed though have an individual entry containing the exact health, so it’s not a blanket change, someone actually had to go and edit the HP of these bosses, which makes me think that it was very much intentional, however that doesn’t mean it’s balanced ofc

[Dellyna]

That’s doubtful. Killed the Champion of the Warmaker a couple of times (five or six) on beta, only once did he drop a legendary weapon in addition to his usual loot, otherwise all he dropped was just various amounts of scraps. I think some of the developers might have fat-fingered the health input so the originally intended health-pool reduction from 17,000 to 14,500 accidentally turned into a buff (24,500).

It’s a long and boring fight (way too long, even with a thrall in tow) and the RNG gives you scraps most of the time, so the hitpoint increase does not make any sense.

[Jegg]

The King Beneath is a joke now. Few taps with hardened steel and its dead.

[CodeMage]

@Xevyr

You do realize the boss is scripted to auto-die as soon as you spent a bit of time killing the ghosts that appear? You never actually had to hit or damage this boss at all… he stands up… he’s been sitting for centuries… his blood clot goes to his brain or something and dies of a stroke

Has anyone ever confirmed that this was intentional? The whole encounter is extremely underwhelming, but I’ve never figured out if it was meant to be.

[EduMariano]

its fair