[PVP] Was body vaulting intended for long safe storage of items?

Conan Exiles General Discussion Feedback
81

I guess I find my self on the opposite side of this. I don’t find offlining (and I’ve done a bunch of it) to be particularly engaging. You can freely scout bases outside of raid time, find a weak spot, stockpile explosives, and be in and out in less than an hour in most situations with minimal resistance. You can even walk in pre raid time to avoid defenses if you are just dumping loot.

Raiding a base while players are online, in my opinion, is some of the most fun content CE can provide. More importantly, it is fun for the person/people being raided - and that is far more important. I get that the games moniker is “build, survive, dominate”, but the key IMO to successful PvP is making being “dominated” by others fun (lol).

Coupled with the fact that building creativity is now under new (ambiguous) limits via TOS enforcement, I don’t think it is intellectually lazy to want to shift the meta away from offlining.

82

You misunderstood my suggestion. If the body disappears after 7 days and they add a Player->Kill(); to it, then you won’t lose your stuff right after disconnecting from the server. They need to stay offline for 7 days in order the code to kick in.

Also any code can bug out. DBD can be buggy where someone can raid you despite having protection. I remember back then when you could do damage to buildings on PvE just by logging out after igniting a bomb.

83

I personally would expect my character to die from starvation or thirst in a survival game, even when logged out.

I mean it’s just REALISTIC when you don’t eat or drink for 3 or more days :slight_smile:

Realism, isn’t that what a lot of people strife for here on the forums?

84

Online true raiding as a f***ing blast ! But, it is too easy to avoid straight up combat currently. The risk just isn’t there do to game mode breaking exploits that suck the soul out of most best parts of playing on a pvp server.

Yes! Thank you !

If you are in a building you could last for a bit longer without food maybe as your body would not be fighting the elements to keep your body temperature stable.

I would figure that they could say that loyal thralls could keep you hydrated for a time ( big stretch) .

85

You’re right. It’s not engaging. But raiding in itself isn’t engaging to me. It’s just a means to the ends. I don’t need anything from them and it always leaves a sour taste in my mouth afterwards and that means I never initiate the attacks but I certainly ensure I can finish them with a mixture of decoys, tactical retreating, hit and runs with popcorning their stuff, and letting them waste resources. It always turns to them running to outsiders that come in and server wipe. After about 30 days, the server is barren as all smaller clans and solos get caught in the mess and the visitors leave and I start again. Raiding is just boring, IMHO because of the formulaic responses everyone has over it. “You p***y”, “you can’t fight”, “I got friends” blah blah blah. The fact remains that my views of PvP and others are different and so we are truly playing different games. The point to all of this is simple. I want to promote diversity in methodologies. I want people to creatively build and you can’t get that with meta as everyone runs to that method and it just gets boring.

86

This needs to be the subject of another thread to call out this absurdity . Hey guys I am going to throw out the large back of stuff that the server god will take care of for me so my lazy a** don’t have to secure it from reclaiming from the person/people I am raiding. This and I know why the mechanic exists but it simply feels wrong to be able to do this. I know why the lazy a**es do .

They do it because they don’t want to be weighed down by the stuff and they don’t want the player from being able to regrab the bag so they just throw it out and make the server do their job for them, hence the lazy part.

But it doesn’t stop there as the game still ?!?!? allows you to simply wack the bag of stuff a few times and poof the bag magically (Sorcery is here early guys! ) disappears no matter how much stuff is in it. Hours of farm gone in seconds and with no drawback or negative efect to wacker, who didn’t want to risk or simply as too lazy to lug it home.

Thank you again for ruining a good server btw it sounds like.

Yes, you are playing a thieves game with no meaningful dangerous traps or guards.

87

I don’t disagree with you on the nature of some PvP players, but I am a big believer that the offline meta is a large contributor in the “wipe or be wiped” mindset that empties servers. I love the building system in CE, even more so in finding clever ways to optimize structures - and I share a distaste for over centralized metas.

I just think body vaulting + offline meta + server transfer = a recipe for the worst version of CE official PvP.

88

No, people want consistent rules within the structured game universe created–or immersion for short. Not realism. 2 different things. And body vaults are no where as game breaking as offline when it comes to raid servers.

You know why fortnite works pvp wise? Because I can log off and I don’t have to worry about starting from farther behind than my competition. Offlining basically destroys competitive balance because someone wanted to be healthy and not log on 6 hours a day l, 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year.

The only people who like offline are ones that don’t like pvp. They usually play for 8-10 hours farming during non raid time, and then have a clan mates who monitor server, wipe noobs, or if a clan gets footing, wait for an offline attempt.

89

Ummm no. I play when I can and hardly during raid hours. I would actually benefit the most from removal of offline raiding as I play the alliance politics game and just have everyone kill each other while I sit collecting my empire’s loot and no one can stop me …which is a problem. See the thing is that if you are one 24,7 there should be some perk in that level of dedication…you get a nice public base with little cerebral effort. Those of us that can’t do that have to be smarter than everyone else to succeed. Fake bases, hidden caches, decoys, etc etc etc. I want that promoted. You aren’t going to get that with PvE-c extreme which is what I am calling PvP no offline…that isn’t PvP in my opinion…just more ways to not put your stuff at risk.

90

I’m playing a strategy game. Look no one at level 60 NEEDS to raid. Within 3 days, you can collect what you want without attacking anybody. But raiding is part of the game…and a critical one if you are playing strategy…what I do with the spoils of a raid is completely up to me. Don’t like the idea of it going away? Well don’t attack me! As I said, I never initiate. Im sorry everyone gets bent out of shape on this but I’m not playing Conan just to be some weird mortal Kombat experience. I’m playing a strategy game that has my stuff at risk…heck if I had my way PvP would be 24/7…yes constant threat. I want less security in PvP not more. It’s a challenge then.

91

I’m okay with offline raiding occasionally, just not as a centralized meta. Trying to make CE into MK is a mistake I agree, but it shouldn’t feel like a damn Tamagachi either - where if I ignore it for a few moments for real life obligations it poops itself and dies.

I’d be fine with 24/7 raids, PvP was healthier back when that was the case IMO. Heck, I’d be happy if defending thralls were aggro 24/7 if only to stop free scouting.

I don’t think the solution has to be no body vaulting, no transfers, no offlining, or no raid times. It can be a combination or amalgamation of any of the four, to varying degrees individually. However, I do not think the current solutions satisfy any reasonable perception of what CE official PvP should be.

92

PvP is Player vs Player.
What we have now is Farm vs Casual. And Best business is to make the game ENJOYABLE for casuals. The biggest turn off for most who I talk to is ,“I don’t want to live on the game, and PVE is too easy (to them at least)”. So as a business, it should drive FC to find a way to let players protect thier bases while they live a healthy life outside the game. FC does not charge by the hour last I checked. They make money by selling DLC. Plus, the farming during non raid hours is absolutely why builds can get as big as they do, breaking the ToS. Reduce free farm time to looking over ones shoulder, and allow me to hit your base and maybe get a good little melee going will slow building down organically. Sure alot of the current OGs will quit because they don’t want to be watching for attacks while they are on, but good riddance, because they weren’t really there to pvp, just outfarm and log time others.

93

lol.

94

I guess a solution is coming on its own ?

Had messages from a few people I play with that many of their characters that they have vaulted on have died and all their stuff on them is gone. A few of friends I talk to also have let me know that all of their are dead.

Anyone else having this issue or is this just a coincidence ? Would this be bug to report for them as well ?

95

Stuff like this makes me wish I could give more than one like to a single post. The PVP offline defense tactics such as foundation spam and fence foundation stacking are getting banned left and right, and that turns into a whole bunch of salty posts and clueless calls for building limits.

PVP has always had been riddled with problems, which has been a source of grief for PVE players for years now, but at least until recently that grief has been in form of nerfs. Now that these bans are affecting some of the most toxic portions of the playerbase – because let’s face it, competitive game modes always bring the best in people, don’t they? – we’re getting near constant requests to totally screw up PVE players’ enjoyment of this game.

But I’m afraid I’ve committed the double sin of posting on a PVP topic as a PVE player, and going off-topic. I’ll try to balance it by trying to contribute something to the original topic: body vaulting.

I have no horse in this race, since I don’t play on PVP servers, which makes body vaulting useless to me. As far as I’m concerned, it would be perfectly normal to have your character die at the same time when your body becomes completely inaccessible to other players. After all, leaving bodies littered around the map is not a good idea, but hiding them with their inventory intact is unfair (and also makes me wonder about what it does to the game database in the long run).

Since I understand that there are many PVP players with the opposing view, and it’s no skin off my nose either way, I’m not going to side with either faction. However, there’s one thing I’ve heard often enough from PVP players on these forums, a thing that has been overlooked in the discussion so far: what happens when you come back from an extended period of being logged out and find yourself inside someone else’s base?

It doesn’t happen too often, but when it happens, people come here (rightfully) fuming about it. So if people are opposed to their toons being killed after 7 days, when their body is hidden, how about this: when you come back, you respawn at one of the noob spawns instead of wherever it was you logged out?

96

I did skim over most of the discussion. But I would like to make one point, if Funcom is listening, and that’s if you are going to make changes to “body vaulting” then you should make sure that those changes apply to PVP and to PVP Only.

Sometimes people forget that there are other players out there who aren’t part of the hardcore PVP scene. And you have to think about how it will effect them.

If you’re new to the game, do you want to find out you’re being erased every week? Building a base and keeping it refreshed is an option, not a requirment. We’re not all hardcore players. Some of us are casual.

And I guarantee you that the PVE community wont like it if another PVP change comes and slaps them upside the head. I can already hear the screeching from PVE clan members coming back dead. Keep the PVP changes in the PVP realm.

You want to auto-kill a body after a week? Fine, but keep it in the PVP realm.

You want a body to stay on the server forever? Fine, but keep it in the PVP realm. (The PVE servers will crash under the weight of all those un-killable bodies.)

97

Very, very good point. I went ahead and put a [PVP] in the title .

98

FWIW, PVE newbs always get slapped by this. Most don’t get completely erased – although I’ve seen people come here to the forums and say something along the lines of “WTF, I was gone for a month and now everything is gone” – but the vast majority of newbs lose at least one wheel or pen because they don’t know about decay and claim mechanics.

The game should have journey steps and/or additional lore to help teach players about claim, decay, and stability. A few loading screen hints aren’t enough, because:

  1. they’re random, so you might not get to see the ones that matter
  2. people tend to stop reading them after a while, especially after they start repeating or after they see a joke like “don’t eat yellow snow”
  3. they tend to be too short to fit a proper explanation about stuff like claim, decay, and stability
  4. even if you pay attention to each one, there are people whose hardware is fast enough that they won’t be able to read a long one before the loading screen is gone

Sorry for the somewhat off-topic rant here, but it’s a pet peeve of mine.

Or make sure to teach the players what’s going to happen. If you know how the game works, then you can prepare, whether it’s PVP or PVE.

On PVE side, if you’re solo – no clanmates – and you stay away for more than a week, you’ve lost everything. Your inventory is going to be a drop in the ocean compared to all the other stuff you’ll have lost.

If you do have clanmates, then you don’t have to lose anything at all (barring bugs): put your inventory in a chest, log out, and let your clanmates refresh everything.

Um, unless Funcom did something extremely clever that I haven’t noticed, the bodies do stay on the server forever. They’re just not rendered. If official servers aren’t already crashing due to an accumulation of all the players who stopped playing over the course of 4 years, then I don’t see why they should start crashing due to a change that would mostly affect the client. :man_shrugging:

Honestly, I think that auto-killing would be okay, but if players don’t want that, it would still be better to have auto-hidden bodies respawn (with their inventory intact) at a newbie spawn when they come back.

As I’ve already pointed out, respawning them where they logged out can wreak havoc on someone unsuspecting on a PVP server, someone who built a base on top of what seemed like a perfectly empty spot only to find their stuff missing when a body-vaulted toon logged back in.

On PVE, this can be equally frustrating, but this time it’s for the person who came back: they’re suddenly trapped in someone else’s base and if that someone else is offline, there’s nothing they can do except suicide their toon and lose all their stuff.

99

This is off-topic, but I’ve been thinking for a while now that this might be the source of many PVP problems. I mean, who isn’t level 60? No-one needs to raid… and most people don’t, much. They farm and try to build impregnable bases, and play politics. People in this discussion have brought up Fortnite and Mortal Kombat, and they work as PVP games because everyone is roughly equal and you lose nothing (but pride) when you lose.

In CE when another person raids you and steals or destroys your gear, or you lose it in a fight, that’s HOURS (probably days) of your time gone. Not to mention most people tend to enjoy accumulating stuff and feel pain when they lose it. So raiding and fighting in CE means you need to be OK with causing other people far more pain and frustration than your average PVP game. I don’t think Funcom did this on purpose. If they did it was a weird and terrible idea business-wise lol. But that’s what we have here in PVP: a game where raiding for loot is actually pointless and people have to actively choose to attack others, not out of necessity but just to drink their tears.

Unfortunately I don’t have an answer. I’ve always just leaned towards 24/7 PVP as the solution. This would make it much harder for PVP players to accumulate stuff, so they always have a sense that everything’s temporary and it’s about the fight and the raid not the loot. Everyone I think would have a clearer idea then about why they’re raiding - just for fun. Trying to defend your loot would be clearly pointless. To get on topic for a bit, body vaulting would need to go away for 24/7 PVP to work.

100

As a hardcore pvper on xbox i can umderstand peoples concerns with this as i have my own even though i use it to my advantage as well, since i just got dev wiped by a salty clan who suck at pvp, i have an insurance policy. This is kind of the problem with allowing BVs to persist as it will be impossible to fully get rid of rival clans who are diligently storing goods in well placed BVs. My crew and i amass riches on multiple servers after defeating our enemies, BV what we need, then migrate to a more popular server to enjoy a new pvp experience while we wait for previous servers to repopulate. This however isnt always the case , most people just quit the game because of the time investment, as is the nature of the beast with survival games. I do agree that BVs are kind of lame and cheezy, im usually too lazy to do it as often as i should, but as a hardcore pvper , it is essential to not start from the ground up, as most of us want to just scrap as much as possible. I dont mind grinding, i can farm with the best of em, but id rather be on the battlefield. Having BVs to jumpstart this process is such a boon to combat grinding fatigue.
If you want my quick solutions to do away with BVs:

If a body is passed out for more than a given number of time ( days ) , have a beam of light ( similar to an t3 altar) emit from that location to prevent a body hidden with mesh geometry. This will discourage players trying to hide BVs out in the open and give others a chance to grab the goodies. This might just encourage players to BV in their own base, well if that base gets raided then bye bye loot.

Have passed out bodies die after a certain number of days without logging in, perhaps the food/water depletes exponentially faster as time goes on. Players will have to keep relogging the BV to keep it alive, thus keeping it loaded into the server. Combine that with a light leading to the body and it becomes a chore to maintain.

Increase all resource farming on officual pvp servers, or convert some pvp servers to a Fast PVP server. If i can farm up an entire defendable base within a few hours after getting complety demolished i wouldnt need to BV. Make a few 5X gather/thrall xp gain server so pvpers can just do what we want to do, fight. Being dev wiped after 4 years(2 years for me) my clan lost somethimg funcom cant give back: a tremendous time investment.
2 options for this could include :
Weekly resource gathering multiplier increase, 2-3 times.
Convert dead pvl servers into Fast PvP.

These are just some thoughts that i feel could improve this game, which is what we all want. We complain because we want this game to be great, but this game has been out for 4-5 years and some big changes need to be made still.