I don’t understand why these issues take so long to fix. There are numerous problems and exploits in the game which I won’t mention for the sake of this thread.
Let’s talk about the [Aesir Chieftain Spear] or [Blood Crystal Spear]. It has a base damage of 72/89. You’d think that changing it back to its normal stats would be super complicated and expensive, maybe costing millions of dollars. But it’s actually as easy as opening the Dev Kit, going into the ItemTable.DB, and just adjusting the item values to what they’re supposed to be…
This is just an example of fixing a weapon that has extra damage, but I remember when they had a oneshooting mace around that I will not mention just in case, because I don’t fully trust that Funcom has fixed said item and I don’t feel like having this thread removed.
Anyways, with this said I just hope there’s a good reason for funcom taking weeks/Months/Season to fix what takes less than one hour in total.
Some issues have a delay awaiting certification for all platforms the game is on.
Further, as this one understands it, Funcom does not do their own porting of the game to consoles, but instead has a middle-ware studio they outsource to.
The other issue may be time/staff.
Rather than handle all the easy things at once, certain other bugs (memory overflow, for example) may be flagged as priority, and the small stuff, like certain weapon damage being off, is left to fester until the priority items are addressed.
This one doesn’t think they have many intern-kuns to hand off the little tasks to, perhaps all of those staff are tasked with Dune related work.
Have you submitted a resumé?
This is not a joke, they probably need more devs and you may be able to negotiate a work from home arrangement.
I can’t guess at anything regarding FC’s internal workings, but I do know to push updates on consoles and the Microsoft Store on PC, cost money AND has to go through a verification process every time. Likely similar for Steam, but my guess is Steam is more dynamic in both process making it require less of both.
This one would opine a dissent.
RE: Jank is Charming.
This one disagrees. A tiny amount of jank in a non impactful way can be amusing. But the higher the price tag and the more prestigious the studio, the less tolerable any jank is. That’s the difference between indie games and mega corp offerings, the polish. This one expects a team of well funded professionals to produce a tight product. This one is far more forgiving of a rag tag band of underfunded dreamers having a grasp that does not match their reach.
His notation of game as art is true at times, and may have been more pervasive in the past, but when one is the multi-million dollar establishment, one ceases to do art, at about the point one starts to do business. It’s a motivational point. Art is made to fulfill the creative drive and express creativity. A product is made to fulfill the bank account and maintain industry relevance.
His overall point is, however, very well articulated and supported, that the over abundance of caution may be leading to a treadmill of overpriced mediocrity from AAA studios.
But to bring this back to Conan Exiles… who thinks that too much caution is applied?
(@HappyFaceOne please do not embarrass us with threads like these )
The only reason you can look at that is because Funcom decided to put some effort into releasing a devkit and supporting mods, I’m not sure trying to weaponize it against them is such a bright idea just because you have some burning PvP issue at hand.
And yes, while this particular case isn’t too complicated to solve, some of them are… (even the other weapon you mention had runtime generated weapon damage via code and not a fixed value in a table).
Some issues are more critical than others… and frankly I wouldn’t put this one too high up the list either… like… some PvP players are stabbing each-other with a spear that does more damage than the rest… so what? It’s not like they’re not using various other exploits 24/7… if they fix this, they’ll move on to the next… (and even THEIR only issue with it is that it’s not a basegame item)
For example they fixed the problem that was causing widespread desync pretty fast, so I’m glad they focused on that one. This is not like a mod, there’s not just one person working on it or two… people can’t just jump in to correct a damage number because they feel like it. Source code is controlled and synchronized across various studios and countries… someone else doing something more important might have priority on the itemtable until they finish that work
How I am embarrasing the modding community when asking something out of ignorance because I dont understand why something that takes me 10 min to fix takes them weeks to months to do (Especially with the amount of people asking to be fixed)
The “oneshot mace” its easy to fix, I am aware that it has nothing to do with the static damage otherwise it wouldnt oneshoot while showing one damage on Heavy/light, but its something you can easily fix since I had to do it for my community.
Its just “some pvpers” now because Funcom pushed all its pvp players away by not only not fixing this kind of “funy” bugs (Three shot spear its just an example) but also ignoring and adjusting its game to the pvers to make everything easier for them while destroying the PVP, I guess this is what happens when the Devs make decidions based on their 1vs1 auto-facing targetlock pvp spars in coop.
It’s just the attitude of trying to weaponize the devkit they made for us. Like, I get it to some degree, but realize that they can also choose NOT to give us a devkit And then you won’t even be able to fix it for your own server.
Speaking of…
Based on this you play on a private server in your own community with mods and you are making the mod for that community…
Then why not fix the spear too? that’s also equally a 5 minute job… heck you can also make sure all previous copies are adjusted to the new values.
I don’t particularly think they make any decisions based on that… more like they make decisions based on what makes money… since it’s a company at the end of the day and one that now has some owners who like money a LOT. The same pressure though is probably what’s responsible for all these bugs making it into release.
In any case, I just chimed in because I really think it’s a bit bold calling them out with a topic like this and I’m saying this as someone who previously mentioned similar things on these forums… however that was after several months of missed opportunities to type a number and I did it jokingly as part of another thread, not painting a giant target on my back that “Hey… I have your source code that you gave me… now I’m going to use it to paint you out as lazy BOOOO” see what I mean?
They cant take the Dev kit from us, its what keeps their game alive, its the only reason why there are still players invested enough in this game to make this kind of threads, and you know that more than anyone else since you are a modder.
Yes, I play in my own private server, yes I had to fix all kind of stuff from rolling-Attack spam to rotating when attacking ( Aka. "Here, have fun hitting all your hits now that you have aim glitch)…Did I mention that you cant add c++ without risking your mod to explode?..I like to play vanilla because I have a group of friends that are still invested and believe that eventually they will fix this situation “next patch”.
Anyways, I dont expect you to reply because theres nothing else to say, Im not weaponising the dev kit Im just curious to know the reason behind why what takes me 10 min to do ( 5 min to open the dev kit, cocking the updating) takes them weeks or months, peace.
While I wish that were the case, sadly that is absolutely not true anymore There was “one time” long time in the past where yes… modders helped keep interest and keep the lights on, however that time is long gone…
Currently FYI their console market is larger than PC and they can’t use mods on console. It’s probably something along the lines of 60% / 40% in the favor of consoles… though we can only speculate about the exact number… they did confirm the fact that consoles are in the lead.
On top of that mods are essentially free competition to their item shops now… as some people don’t buy from the bazaar as they can download similar items as part of a free mod. So no… we’re not nearly as important as a lot of modders seem to think sadly Although yes, there is still a significant community that uses mods, so that part is true, does not mean they can’t suddenly change their policy on that if they feel like we’re more of a hassle and they can survive cutting us.
They can also choose to make every new feature non-moddable, like they did with the event system, which would be the “passive” form of cutting modders or at least making life difficult…
Part of the reason we still have new features moddable is because there are a handful of people at Funcom who support modders and fight for new features to be mod-friendly, as it would be way easier for them not to make it so. Those people deserve all the respect as you can be certain they have colleagues and friends asking them every time “why…” yet they still stand up for mod support.
Then keep changing the things you feel you need to change Nothing wrong with that, that’s literally what I’ve been trying to get you to understand… that having the ability to do so is not some god given right of yours, but a privilege that other people keep fighting for you to enjoy…
I did though… and you’re sort of proving my point about the attitude I detected in your post…
At this point I won’t reply anymore, however I really hope that you won’t either, or at least think before you type
Cheers!
I agree that bugs should be fixed faster. But comparing the amount of time needed to fix a single bug to the wait time is not quite fair imho.
Laying a single brick only takes a few seconds. But building a house still takes months.
Servicing a single customer at a supermarket checkout only takes a minute. Still, we have cues.
The amount of time an employee can actually be productive depends a lot on corporate culture, leadership and so on. Maybe the Devs are kept from doing what they, too, probably want to do by having to file reports, sit in meetings and take part in courses on how to be more productive.
If all your mod does is modify the itemtable, then yes, changing those numbers and clicking deploy is a very simple fix, takes 10 seconds even.
If your mod changes much more, and you’re in the middle of getting some blueprints to work right, as well as some other coding and tables to talk to each other, then you have to wait to deploy until that work is finished.
Same thing with the actual game itself. The current version of the game that they are working on is not the one we are getting in the hotfix. They also have multiple people on multiple teams working together. Before making any sort of update deployment they need to make sure everything is talking to each other and everything is good to go. Going back and making a small change is a bit of a waste of time as they’ve already done it on whatever working version they are on.
10 minutes of work becomes 20 minutes if you do it that way. And if they did it for every small itemtable disparity, 10 minutes becomes several hours, hours they could have spent elsewhere. They don’t have the luxury of repeating work like us modders who do it for a simple hobby do.
It would be cheaper if they actually learned how to run excel. BEFORE releasing a patch, it would take less than 1 employee an hour to pulk the items table for weapons armor, use a fornula to look forbweapons outside a range and correct. Something like T3 maces dmg between 50 and 70, AP between 10 and 15. Anything outside that would hoghlight red. Then send out a report to make sire the outliers are intended. So then it wont cost a hotfix. i am simplifyng it, but reality is that it is a QA breakdown. Or lack of caringbto run a verifiaction at all.
What I am referring to is inefficiency, not quality.
In the example by the OP where the spear has incorrect values, they’ve already made the adjustment in one of the builds. If they were to take the time to make the adjustment in the current version and then push the patch, it would be a waste of time and man hours.
You don’t do that when being paid.
As for your comment about using excel, they do. They’ve given the modding community some of the spreadsheets they have used for those functions.
The reason there is a QA issue on item values is probably because the game is overly complex with the various systems to the point that its not possible to QA it in any feasible amount of time. But this is why I’ve made several suggestions in the past to gut much of the extraneous additions and tiers.
Items and followers have several iterations of tiers of complexity on them to get a few points of damage here or there and that doesn’t make any sense and greatly increases the likelihood of a value being out of wack.
If anybody should be embarrassed then its Funcom. He is actually right and you know it.
When Tencent bought Funcom they presented it as a great thing for Conan Exiles. The game is being developed further, we’re are taking care of it. It gets great updates and attention.
It wasn’t hard to see where the game went from there. They used the games popularity and this community to turn it into a complete cashgrab. And that is all their focus lies on.
It doesn´t fit if on one side the game allegedly gets all attention it needs when on the other side they downgraded the stuff to the bare minimun. But it shows whats really going on behind doors. Its not that shiny and its scary. Because the minute people start to refuse to throw money at the bazar the game is done.
There are a lot of fixes that could have already happend. I know that, you know that, the rest of the community knows it. Constantly finding excuses is not gonna change it. I just remember the thread where I said: a hotfix is not a hotfix anymore when weeks have passed. And it gets even worse when the fix is not even a fix.
I don´t think people expect too much if they want the game to be playable and that Funcom takes care of the game by providing regulare fixes. And by that I don´t mean once in a while.
If I avoided most programming context of the game, I could find the time, too. It’s just not that simple for most.
I’m wondering if modding should be disabled. Because it appears as if Funcom has gone out of its way to support the small modding crews. We could see real progresss without mods.
Funcom could get p2w developer licenses, but that is just an idea. Right now they are supporting this crowd at the cost of real players.
Uh, no. I highly doubt modding is holding up development progress in the slightest. Developers rarely concern themselves with breaking mods when they release updates. It’s up to mod authors to keep up with the developers, not the other way around.
Modding is too much work, any lunacy on somehow the issue being modders understanding the problem because of the “source engine” was released from funcom is wildly insane.
The “source engine” is unreal, several of the aspects are locked behind their c++ (though most is written in blueprints) and they have consistently moved slow and broken many things, like the time they copied and pasted the armored pen for the stables thus introducing a dismantle dupe.
the people that built those initial datatables I have no doubt are not the same people now editing them, as they do tend to have less caution than your average modder.
But it’s their game and their culture we are just along for the ride at this point, do what I did, if you don’t feel modding for it is worth your time, walk away, if you don’t feel playing the base game is worth your time, do the same, I am not happy with the state very often but no one is forcing me to play it.
)
And then you won’t even be able to fix it for your own server.
see what I mean?
There was “one time” long time in the past where yes… modders helped keep interest and keep the lights on, however that time is long gone…