Legendaries are Broken

The current legendaries system is broken. The ease at which you can farm and hoard legendaries makes using anything else as a weapon pointless.

Removing the ability to repair them was a step in the right direction, but they are still way too easy to farm right now.

  • Skeleton key chests cannot be a 100% legendary drop chance. With how easy they are to farm it is balance breaking.
  • Either remove legendaries from chests (and add them to boss loot pools) or expand the chest loot pools to include star metal/hardened steel/acheronian items and decrease the chance that legendaries drop from them.

The goal should be star metal/hardened steel/acheronian being the primary weapons used. Then when you get a legendary it’s actually something special to use for the period you have before it breaks. It not being repairable makes sense because it’s so rare that you can’t possibly have the knowledge to repair it.

Right now you can have chests full of spares because farming the cat/spider/bug is so mind numbingly easy that it doesn’t matter. You can skip from iron weapons straight to legendaries.

//You can skip from iron weapons straight to legendaries.//
This.

Yes, for everyone who knows patterns of each boss attacks it’s so easy to earn the legendary weapon right away, in the start of the game. It’s another extreme than before, when you could not open legendary chests before reaching lvl 60, now for change your level does not matter at all.

I would not restrict the level of the person to open the chest, but maybe would try to push it the way that each and every weapon could have it’s requierments, considering attributes. So even if you are lvl 5, you are not going to use your Blade of adventurer, because that one requires that much points in strength (for example). So you would be forced to go through the babysteps anyways… But many experienced players would be outraged by this anyway.

About amassing the legendaries, yep… I partly hate the fact, that even if you decide not to pick up the artifact from the chest, your key is consumed, but not sure how it would work if it was not like this. Also putting the legendaries in the inventory of the boss, who is that easy to kill would not solve the problem you are pointing on, IMO. Mostly people kill it, then go to the loot chest. The key amassing is only because of the bugged chests, or people grinding the legendaries too much, so there is not enough time for those chests to respawn.

1 Like

In my pve game, I don’t go straight to legendaries because I enjoy the leveling and advancing. I tried it recently and it just wasn’t fulfilling and I learned nothing new. So yeah if you PVE, then just don’t do it. :man_shrugging:

2 Likes

Oh, for…

Why?

Seriously, why are people so desperate to perpetuate – and even exacerbate – the crappy slot machine game mechanics? Why not just go to Las Vegas and have the fun you crave there?

What do you find so fun and engaging in the process of endless grind until a random number generator generates the “right” random number?

Yeah, and guess why that is? Because people who love slot machines kept complaining about how legendaries are not legendary enough, since crafted weapons were good enough to be used in normal gameplay. So Funcom listened to that crowd and now we have legendary weapons that are much better than any crafted weapon but can’t be repaired.

As a result, all crafted weapons were made pretty much obsolete as long as you’re okay with obsessively grinding for legendary weapons. And your solution is to make that grind even worse?

Except that it’s perfectly possible to grind for days or even weeks without getting a replacement. I’ve been trying for a couple of weeks now to ensure that I have a Momentum to replace the one I’m using after it breaks. As a result, I’ve got tons of Shields of Kutamun and Brittle Bastards and Zhaibar Knives and whatnot, but not a single freaking Momentum.

The only way you can call it “mind numbingly easy” is if you don’t distinguish between legendaries at all and you’re fine with getting any legendary. And that’s not exactly an attitude that says you value legendaries.

Especially since some legendaries are disproportionately better than all others in their class. If you know that and still treat all legendaries as interchangeable, then you don’t “value” legendaries, you’re treating them like status symbols. Some of us care more for having fun than showing off.

Well, yes, and rightly so. You want to change something that’s a matter of skilled play and force everyone to the lowest common denominator, and for what, exactly?

11 Likes

There is no OR… This part… this part is fine… and we’ve talked about it before.
They could split the legendary weapons up between dungeon bosses so that they have a much much smaller pool, resulting in mitigating the over reliance on RNG and not making it worse like your OR would suggest :slight_smile:

That is simply not in line with the genre… And fair enough, the survival elements have been somewhat toned down over the years and we took on more and more RPG elements… but I think that would be a bit pushing it… Conan is not a MMO… it never claimed to be one and it doesn’t really want to be one as far as the direction shows.
So the basic concept that “if you can find it, you can wear it” I think that will stay forever. Which means they should probably work on the “finding” part.


Personally I would’ve made legendaries just SLIGHTLY better than the best crafted things (I’m talking 1-2 damage points here… not 20-30…), which would have been more than enough to take them out of the “has been” category they’ve been in for a while…

However I would have also taken them out of the legendary chests and did what I mentioned above with them so they’re less RNG and put the better ones on the harder bosses etc.

And I would have NEVER castrated poor world bosses and wildlife in the way they have… I don’t think it’s normal that you can hop off the cross butt naked and punch a Black Kappa to death… which previously scared the hell out of low levels when it spawned… :smiley:
Now it has 163 hp… (had above 1.2k in AoS) and world bosses got a hefty nerf as well… they’re at half HP than what they were at, pretty much turning them into almost free legendary-dispensers.

I avoid picking them up at early levels too just so I can enjoy the crafting system a bit… but I shouldn’t have to put conscious effort into something that should be pretty obvious from a game design point of view (eg. making your own crafting and progression system utterly redundant by these mechanics)

They still sell them at the spire on rotation (weapon merchant to the right of the stairs), just need to be lucky and get the right rotation and you can stock up on them for the winter :rofl:

unless it’s off by one and never does :rofl:

3 Likes

Not exactly true. You can do it from Stone :grin:

All jokes aside, the current Legendary system is… bonkers. As you’ve stated and others have said before, the Legendary weapons/tools are really supposed to be a bit of a temporary buff. To be used in situations that the player finds favorable to their experience, but relying on reliable crafted weapons and tools for the majority of their endeavors.

Right now the Legendaries are so common that people can and do base their entire experience around them. For a while we even had them do so for very specific weapons. This isn’t as bad as it used to be prior to Age of Sorcery where you’d unlock perks with specific weapons equipped and be somewhat gimped without. But in Age of Sorcery and even Age of War its still too heavy into the abundance.

But that’s all assuming level 60 established characters. The problem exacerbates at lower levels due to the ease of the bosses. The risk doesn’t match the mint of a reward you receive. The ‘skill required’ to slay these bosses is not equal to the reward of the weapons from the chests.

I do agree that these chests should be removed from these locations and the bosses instead give resources instead. The alternative is to make them require skill and mastery of the game as well as decent equipment to down them. But being as their location is right in where people usually play and level up through, I’m not certain this is a great idea.

I could go with this. Though I think dungeon bosses need a overhaul with their mechanics… in the fact that they need them. Our hardest bosses in Conan Exiles have the complexity of low level tutorial dungeon bosses in just about all MMORPGs. And those players are not the pinnacle of active gameplay.

See, this right here is what makes me, for lack of a better word, despair. The idea is not bad at all, but as soon as I start thinking about it, I realize that the problem with it is not what we’re asking for, but who we’re asking.

Take a good, hard look at the way this aspect of the game has been treated recently, and you’ll see a track record of hasty, incomplete adjustments, teetering from one imbalance to a different one.

For your idea to work well, they would have to redistribute legendaries carefully. The strongest, most unique, most rewarding legendaries should drop from the hardest bosses; conversely, the weakest should drop from pushover world bosses like the giant spider.

But what hope do we have of that happening? They gave legendaries a “rebalance” in Age of War, and that’s how we ended up with the Mace of Thag being utter shіt, and Momentum being (theoretically) available by killing giant spiders.

Yeah, that. I wouldn’t hold my breath. :man_shrugging:

image

2 Likes

So let me see if I understand this correctly. You wish to add even more manufactured grind to the game thus exaccerbating the RNG mechanic by making the pools even larger. Not to mention adding insult to injury in the process with regard to being unable to repair them!? Unfortunately I am going to have to decline your generous offer.

Specious reasoning. By this logic we stand a greater chance of being unable to repair star metal with its unknown origins, or shrine weapons because they were devised and conjured by a god. You are attempting to rationalize a bad mechanic to suit your own argument.

7 Likes

Well sure :slight_smile: Obviously we’re trying to suggest improvements to the game…
So that would imply that whoever we’re asking wants to improve it…

We’re obviously aiming for the highly optimistic and very theoretical scenario where they actually do a good job at it… and I agree, that I’m also afraid whenever they change things and touch stuff… because what sounds good in theory, might be a very rushed “dump-job”… and yea… creating balance doesn’t work by casually trying to throw rocks on “both sides of a scale” from 20 meters away in your spare time… :man_shrugging:

1 Like

Why? Were we not happy with ancient Lemurian axe output before? Did it change? Is the gameplay with craftables lessen when there was a better option?

What? We can literally craft star metal stuff. You shouldn’t be able to repair things that you don’t know how to make in the first place.

If anything star metal needs to be removed from feats and learning them should involve a quest line. Acheronian will actually have a use then.

1 Like

I actually like that idea. Put star metal recipe within the well of skelos and just drop obsidian. No one is ever going to like it and that furnace…just ain’t going to happen.

How s out instead of legendary weapons, legendary skills. Things you learn to improve you weapons or armor that are somewhat absent…temp regulation, adding certain effects…hell just having a different skin would motivate me just as much if not more

I’ve been churning this over in my head for a while now. I really think that Hardened Steel as the top tier crafting material fits with the setting and the amount of time and effort that goes into making it.

Where as Star Metal seems like it should be this resource that you could use to craft better stuff on occasion or enhance your gear. But to do this would require a readjustment of crafting level 60 equipment.

Something akin to Hardened Steel being a baseline. Star Metal being an uncommon but semi-sustainable upgrade (as they either couldn’t be repaired, or degrade when repaired). And then Epics and Legendaries being rare and rarer peaks in performance, but temporary with larger gaps in use than even Star Metal.

But Hardened Steel should be the baseline that you go to and trust. As Conan’s father said.

That is from the perspective it has been implemented as a gamified mechanic. From a lore standpoint it is not something the local village blacksmith has the ability to just pick up and work. Depending on which lore source you are reading it is described as having cosmic/non-terrestrial origins, a gift from the firmament, hailing from the outer dark, or being a gift from Crom. Either way its origins and properties are far more uncertain than that of a weapon wielded by prominent heros of the past.

In addition we were perfectly capable of repairing Legendary items in the past, and for years at that, until a mystical intervention by Funcom fundamentally altered them.

3 Likes

Disclaimer for the nitpickers: there might be some crafted weapons that weren’t made “pretty much obsolete” :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

I’m not sure I understood the question, but here’s my attempt at answering it: before the change, I used a mix of legendary weapons and crafted weapons. Some crafted weapons were better than their legendary equivalents, others were worse.

The change made legendary weapons better than craftables across the board (with possible a exception or two), so now I pretty much use only legendary weapons and dedicate a chunk of my time grinding for their replacements, and getting more and more stressed out with each grind cycle that doesn’t drop a suitable replacement.

The irony is that both the legendaries and the craftables were more enjoyable before the change. Not all of them, but there was a selection that encompassed both categories. Among the legendaries, there were several nice-to-haves that I could play without but loved getting by chance, so the RNG wasn’t a problem; and there were others that I strongly preferred to have, but their drop chances were reasonable, so RNG wasn’t a big deal either. Among the craftables, there was a huge selection that I never bothered with (most of the iron and steel tier and pretty much all of the hardened steel tier), but there were several that were must-haves for me.

Now, all but one of those craftables are strictly inferior to legendaries, so I don’t get to enjoy using them, but I also don’t enjoy grinding for legendaries.

6 Likes

Are you sure you’re playing the right genre? You seem to want to make this game into an MMO.

4 Likes

Just pointing out no one needs to use the 103 axe of the lion. I have used my ancient Lemurian axe and I doubt I will stop anytime soon because it’s more reliable now than it ever was. Yes it’s fun to get one of those legendary weapons. It’s like going to the gum ball machine and getting a toy. That’s actually fun and exciting. It brings memories of my youth getting that surprise…like a cereal surprise toy. But can we count on it? No. Those that will grind the Russian roulette to get their Meta weapon of choice shouldn’t be considered hardcore or anything like that. They should be pitied, like we would do with someone like Veruca Salt that just kept buying and buying goods to get the surprise gift they actually wanted.

Okay, so if I understand you correctly, you’re not defending this game design or claiming it’s better, you’re just pointing out psychological tricks to cope with it? :smiley:

4 Likes

I’m saying the game design allows RNG surprises and these surprises now have true benefits but they shouldn’t be considered mandatory anymore than pvp demands SVA builds. It’s up to us, as players, to play as we want. Just because the designer put a carrot out, doesn’t mean we have to chase after it. Maybe that’s the point. Maybe that is exactly why Den and team let’s me cry out for intent with only an echo as a response. We don’t have to do what we are told or collect what we are shown. We don’t have to limit ourselves. Of course maybe it’s the bourbon, I get more poetic when enjoying a drink.