Lightning Storm should not do building damage

TBH I would settle for a new placeable: Lightning Rods. They could take up to 6 strikes before being destroyed and always attract lightning when storms are nearby. Would need to be repaired between uses. Multiple rods would spread out the strikes to prevent a single rod from being destroyed and leaving the base vulnerable.

Would also help for when your doofus son casts the stupid spell over your castle without your knowledge.

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From my testing as well. My hunch is that some of these tests are being carried out on servers with very atypical settings just to assist the opinion and will of that particular player. Either that or thereā€™s a bug hiding out which allows it to be more powerful on one server than it is on another or in Single Player with default settings.

Really? Thereā€™s a ton of footage of LS doing T3 oneshots on officials. I play on normal server settings and even the community server I play on had this particular spell being used then being banned due to the footage.

What kind of testing have you done that indicated LS doesnā€™t do one shots? What kind of bases are you building? Do you have a video? Screenshots? I find it very hard to believe that youā€™ve never seen LS do a T3 one-shot. Do you have building damage enabled on whatever youā€™re testing? Are you in god mode and standing on the base?

As a ā€œsolo trollā€ I have some good news for the rest of you! They seem to have changed the way decay timers work in 3.0, so thereā€™s no easy way to live out of a chest any more. I tried it yesterday and found out the hard way, lost all the best stuff from a vault I popped. As soon as you leave the area, the chest reverts to 1 hour decay unless there are foundations actually present. No more placing them and deleting them. So if I want a chest, I have to have a base, however small.

People can still body vault though

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oh man that suxā€¦ thanks for sharing. gonna have to rethink how i do some of my stashes,

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Yeah, not all that much. I had tested LS in TL3.01 and it didnā€™t do all that much. However, I tested it again after you wrote that - using ā€œPC Patch 3.0.2ā€. I conjured it 25 times in SP with the same settings as my official PvP servers.

  • The average number of strikes (lightning bolts) per conjure was about 13.
  • The average number of one-hit on T3 blocks was 3.7 per conjure.
  • The vast majority of block hits did less than 100 HP.
  • The total number of one-hit on vaults was 1 over 25 conjures.
  • The total number of vaults destroyed was 5 over 25 conjures.
    One was due to the destruction of underlying blocks.
    Three were due to multiple visual hits >2.
  • The average number of underlaying block destruction events was 2.7 per conjure.
  • The number of times LS did < 100 HP to vaults even when there were multiple visual strikes that hit it, was 16:
    image image
  • The number of times vaults took > 100K HP damage in a single visual hit was 4:
    image image
  • It seems to discriminate between player characters and objects - favoring players. The first three tests were trashed and not counted because over 75% of the strikes were on nearby character players myself included.

So, ummmā€¦ yeahā€¦ I hope this is useful to the @Community as well. :slight_smile:

Please keep LS damage like it is. The 100K bolts are one shotting large parts of T3 bases and making most clans quit the game. Servers are laggy with 40 players anyways, best to make them all quit playing /s

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400k average damage per conjure is A LOT for the cost to craft and cast a lightning storm.
Just compare it to avatarsā€¦

If a lightning strike would do fixed 10k damage per hit on building pieces, then it would be way more balanced.

Or keep the system but do not allow it to hit building pieces below others, so the strikes can only target the most upper ceilings/foundations/whatever. Instead of randomly blowing a full production room as @Debacle described. There is a method called RayCast that does the trick.

For Unity: Unity - Scripting API: Physics.Raycast

Change it, so it avoids breaking stuff INSIDE bases before breaking the ceiling first.
Like here:
https://cdn-cf-east.streamable.com/video/mp4/lmgysn_1.mp4?Expires=1663387020&Signature=LCopAN4JuUqnpWbK8A2AeumxaGA1bFQKMlnwyc0qzIoFFRKjLqIviVIUyNLJoWVbM-IsJIaDdvcL4Uotke5MdYdDj25vMFmsUFKdYugamao-K8upyHZYUi5YhDRoB9-Qjp3uk6xgZzSi-~sMG3-AOYDNCTVsVMj~D6zcFe8pzGSRxvgd5XQem6336qeYsdEB~BAhwR1V-v8QI2h-wFtRCekwqlmH2JO0-TxQvcSC15ycABGuzwnWL2h2TX3eaNrP20zEZqzM9R-1-ZHZDGYsOB8fmeC5MOYhRgISmuriceC5Z3gRreRTFJQ7IELZwaWZJYf0PJwzSHTXX3FxUPQZ~Q__&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIEYUVEN4EVB2OKEQ

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Thatā€™s all up to the designer. I donā€™t think I have an opinion. Is it too strong? That depends what FC-Den is going for - I canā€™t really second guess him. Watching the video you posted, the action looks fun as hell to me. I wouldnā€™t automatically watch that and conclude LS was OP. Itā€™s different than previous. The attackers were getting in about what, 5 or 10 minutes faster, something like that?

But the defenders (the few there were) were noobs too - that was fairly obvious to me. My guess is that was the first time they had been raided hard. Nothing was ready, they didnā€™t know what to target, they had no death recovery techniques, etc., etcā€¦

I like the way it plays now. I liked 2.8 too. I think 3.0.2 is better overall. It seems to me that FC wants raids to go faster. Over each of the last 3 or 4 releases they have introduced changes, features and mechanics which allow attackers an easier time of it and defenders put back a step. I think those things are good. Great even! If I wanna play a PvP game I want the pace high! I raid you, you raid me back, all in the same window! Sitting on Ereborā€™s treasure hoard for 150 years like Smaug, works in films maybe but gamesā€¦ not so much!

Itā€™s up to Dennis. If this is yet another step toward faster paced less covetous acquisitive gameplay Iā€™m all for it. People who wanna plant their posteriors on a pile of pillaged plunder will be perfectly pleased to play privates without penalty or punishment! :wink:

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Devs are ā€œinvestigatingā€ if T3 really one shots, while all it takes is 5min in singleplayer to see it. How can investigation be needed when modders even see the 100K damage bolts with the modding tools.

I meanā€¦ Dan (the dev in this thread) already commented that these T3 one-shots were a bug. Youā€™re defending a bug and not an intentional design decision. Exactly what do you think you are defending? Youā€™re not defending an intentional design decision that is for sure.

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Itā€™s far too much damage for the cost of casting. A sorcerer is going to have temporary weapons and armor on anyways so even with it being changed to a full channel thatā€™s not enough of a cost for itā€™s use. It needs to cost many fragments of power and dragonpowder to craft.

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No it does notā€¦ thatā€™s a very bad suggestion.
They simply need to tone down the damage ceiling a bitā€¦ to about half of itā€¦ so instead of potentially oneshotting T3 pieces, at maximum it brings them to half health

Thatā€™s ridiculous. The mats to craft are almost nothing. There is absolutely no risk or effort involved in using lightning storm and it makes every other raiding tool a waste of time. It needs to be brought in-line. One of the biggest issues the players have with the PvP servers is that bases feel paperthin due to how quickly raiding can be done. I canā€™t see any reasonable argument as to why this should exist in this form.

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And thatā€™s perfectly fineā€¦ the point is that there ARE mats and you do have to craft and prepareā€¦ that was the only reason for it, else it would let you cast spells without reagents like pretty much every other game out thereā€¦ The point wasnā€™t to make it hard or unreasonable to be able to cast the spellā€¦

Likeā€¦ if youā€™re involving dragonpowderā€¦ which has nothing to do with itā€¦ then youā€™re better off making explosives since while lightning storm can potentially destroy some blocksā€¦ itā€™s randomā€¦ while explosives are targeted preciselyā€¦ Even in the video @SirDaveWolf posted aboveā€¦ sure lightning storm after several casts granted them a random way inā€¦ did you see the 30 odd bombs they still used to get through the door to the room they actually wanted to go to?

As for fragments of powerā€¦ that is just outright ridiculousā€¦ what does killing PvE bosses have to do with raiding your base?

My point is that youā€™re clearly not trying to make ā€œbalanceā€ suggestions of any reasonable natureā€¦ what youā€™re trying to do is make suggestions that are unreasonable and make the spell inaccessible or just make it too much of a hassle to not be worth it, because you personally donā€™t like it.

Yea sure, it shouldnā€™t be one-shotting blocks with a single strike so their max potential damage per hit needs to be toned down a bit for sure! And it will more than likely happen, if you scroll up even Dennis said as much that it shouldnā€™t be one-shotting t3 blocks. That does not mean making the spell inaccessible due to ridiculous ingredient demands thoughā€¦

That is on purpose, itā€™s not an ā€œaccidentā€ or a balancing bugā€¦ @TeleTesselator also pointed it out aboveā€¦ Basically theyā€™re trying to prevent clans hoarding and sitting on their hoard for ages, theyā€™re trying to make gameplay on PvP servers way more volatile where power can change hands on a daily basis.

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We literally tore down Mia Roseā€™s cave base with several layers of T3 in minutes with LS. They had somewhere between 10-15 rows of wedge foundations with walls for added padding. The amount of damage we accomplished would have probably been equivalent to 100 jars. We did this with 2 LS. TWO. For TKOā€™s base we used a single LS above their base to burn everything that was in the middle. I believe we ultimately used 2LS for that base and then we used jars to blow off every single wall that remained. We did all this while they were online BTW. There is an RNG to the LS but it performing, as others have mentioned in this very post, way too strong.

I cannot find any sense in your counter argument. You seem to be under the impression that DP and Fragments are ā€˜inaccessibleā€™. Even with dragon powder as a requirement itā€™s still far better than using jars in many applications. Also, you can get fragments from various methods on both mapsā€¦ not just killing bosses. LS needs to be fixed on itā€™s damage then it needs to have a cost thatā€™s more in line to itā€™s application. If explosive arrows and jars require DPā€¦ why on earth wouldnā€™t a LS require it as well? Please reply to an answer to that question first.

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Yes, but the goal of raiding is to get in and get stuff from the other clan, no? Nobody would go and waste jars on pointless walls and blocks that lead nowhereā€¦ and often time with LS the benches and chests inside get hurt first and the loot despawns by the time you get thereā€¦ so a LOT of that damage is not useful damageā€¦
When a single storm takes down a buildingā€¦ that is 100% a building issueā€¦ it was relying on very few specific blocks that got vaporized so the rest that it was supporting crumbledā€¦

These reports are very wildly exaggerated. You can see @TeleTesselator literally perform tests above your postsā€¦ and that is consistent with what Iā€™ve seen and itā€™s consistent with the videos @SirDaveWolf posted etcā€¦ Any building that gets completely torn down by one or two storms was just badly built according to 3.0 standardsā€¦ (it is no longer enough to make sure your base has stability on the outsideā€¦ it cannot rely on a single piece on the inside)

No, I am saying that it makes absolutely no sense to use thoseā€¦ likeā€¦ zeroā€¦ and I pointed out why in both casesā€¦

Because itā€™s not an explosive?.. doh?.. You seem to be under the impression that this game has raiding and nothing else and we can just throw in any material in any recipe based on that.

Bottom lineā€¦ if you checkedā€¦ you literally have the lead designer of the game posting in this thread a bit further up saying that theyā€™re looking into the damage part of it as itā€™s not meant to outright one-shot blocks. So that part is not intentionalā€¦ which imo if taken care of and you no longer have extremely high damage random strikesā€¦ will make the spell just fine. Thereā€™s absolutely no need to overcomplicate it and ask for ridiculous ingredients that have absolutely nothing to do with things.

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No. From my experience the point of raid is to take what you can and obliterate what remains so that the clan would not being able to rebuild

So, your solution is to build even bigger more enormously large bases so that enemy would have to summon three LS to destroy your base instead on one?

(edited to make it clear thatā€™s not a reply to you Tele, just using your quote)

No, Iā€™m actually not a fan of overly large buildingsā€¦ but Iā€™m pretty sure you can muster up more than 4 blocksā€¦

You are ignoring what me and others and Dennis said thoughā€¦ it is not supposed to one-shot blocks and it will be addressedā€¦ So I donā€™t get whatā€™s your point with this
Like, this last part of the discussion was strictly about this:

Which I think is a horrible idea and explained why. I am not against reducing the damage spikes of the storm though

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Will see how it works after (if) they fix it. But I donā€™t think that there is a point to defend LS in its current state as itā€™s obviously and clearly broken.