petition is already in, same with a PM to the community manager here 
Its cool, most people do not understand us and that is even more perfect. Our ways are ours. Games come and go, but our friendship doesnt.
I have another, more accurate word for that 
Letâs get some real numbers, EVE style.
There are 8-9 nodes of basalt per gathering instance. One node gives 10 basalt. That gives you an average of 85 basalt per instance on a single run.
One T3 node gains 3-4% per minute. Once exhausted, youâll need around half an hour to get another full node, so your gathering rate is 170 basalt per hour.
You canât swap instances to gather basalt faster, since a newly created instance starts with empty nodes and an empty instance closes down fast.
For the T3 keep (one building!), you need 5000 basalt. That gives you around 29.5 hours of farming. Of course that can be spread among several players, but each one will need his own instance to keep up the gathering rate. And theyâll find very soon that anyone can enter a gathering instance, so to get those 5000 basalt, youâll probably need around 40 hours. Forty very boring hours of active playtime, since most of the time will be spent running around to farm nodes (less than 10 minutes) and waiting for those same nodes to refill, while cursing the other farmers.
And if you log out for inactivity, there goes your full instance!
Fun fact: except for walls and such, the T3 keep is the cheapest building in mats. The others range from 15 000 to 30 000 basalt each. There are 9 other buildings.
And thatâs only for basalt. Youâll need duskmetal, oak and gold as well, even if in slightly less quantities. It comes to around 90 hours of gathering for the keep, and 3 to 6 times that amount of time for every building youâll want past the keep.
And before starting on the T3 keep, youâll need to build the full T1 and T2 cities. They need less resources, but nodes are slower to refill.
And then, there are the walls 
Oh Dear, that again, I almost forgot.
It would be a lot more fun to help you, if you would descend your illusional horse (group of old friends/old guild: not so special). It would be more impressive if your group of old friends would come up with clever plans you would benefit from, but what I see here is kind of: We are proud to choose the worst road possible because we are so specialâŠyeah ok,good luck then, I suppose.
Well, for anyone else who searched this thread for help about new guild cities: With 5-6 players you will need 5-6 years to come close to renown lvl 18, and you do need 454.920 ressources for a T3 city (including walls, which you want because of the artistry).That are ~1600 hours of straight farming.
Who is the one on a high horse. The preson that has played with a large group of people for over 20 years, doing what they always doâŠor a person telling them they should not play that way because he doesnt like it?
Yeah. There was zero point in you posting the way you did and basically shown yourself to be one of the reasons why we do what we do, to keep out drama queens that demand everyone plays the way they do.
We are aware of how much material is needed and are not the least bit concerned with it. Our RPers have already planned out their clan story and have a group of people that have always been hardcore gatherer/crafters.
As you say, 8-9 nodes per instance could equal 84 per run perhaps as high as 170 per hour.
8 people (with near another 20 that enjoy it) that love to gather for hours a day = their building a city far faster than they actually WANT to as building a city is not something that you should be able to do in a week especially since everyone else will be doing it at least a little also.
The only people we game with that remotely care about doing everything NOW NOW NOW are our PvPers and right now, they are iffy about coming to this game since the PvP here is on the weak side. So, until that changes, we do not care about getting max guild rank and city as fast as possible.
Except you wonât get 8 instances. Selective reading wonât help you understand what people are really saying.
I am logged into Crom right now and in Potain, there is a Nu, Balder, Gamma, Thor, Epsilon, Zeta and Theta upâŠand that is just Potain.
if they split up and go to each gather zone, they should be able to get a MINIMUM of 6 zones.
As for selective reading, why do some people continue to chose to ignore all the times I say that they do NOT CARE about getting a max city right away? We are not a race to end guild.
if you get several instances, that means someone spawned them, and can be digging there, so you may end up competing for the same nodes.
I wont be competing, they will and some of those goofballs were doing in all day long in other games where you compete with everyone on your server in the same zones without instances 
Again, selective reading wonât help you understand what people are really saying.
As Cappa (and I) already told you, each open instance except the first one means someone is already in it. So yeah, you have 8 instances, and maybe 2 of those will be fit for farming⊠for a short while, because people will jump at open instances. Itâs impressive the way you reject the knowledge and experience of long-time players simply because âthatâs not how we do it.â
The way you do things has nothing to do with and has no impact on the game mechanics. Iâd love to see you try it in EVE 
Just as a quick info: Since you got a lot of people being level 80 and actively raiding (and doing dungeons + RF I guess?) you can probably buy a lot of mats from the trader because on level 80 you can easily make 5 gold a day by doing a few dungeon runs + quests (of course you can make a lot more if you try to actively farm for money, like 15 - 20). Spending that money on mats might help to speed up the resource gathering if you have like 10 people who make a âguild resource money poolâ.
However, I am not sure how the trader looks on the saga server right now, I donât know if there is a great number of offers for the guild city mats, I guess most of them will be for alchemy crafting. On Crom it might look different once the servers merged and people start to offer all their stuff again (since right now its kinda empty because no one is really playing on Crom).
Selective reading on an argument that is constantly changing.
You give me the amount a person can get per instance and the amount of time it would gather what is needed for ONE building.
I say we know and that just with 8 people will gather at a pace to build FASTER THAN THEY WANT TO.
Then you tell me we wont get 8 instances and tell me I am selective reading because you feel you must insult I guess?
I then prove we CAN get 8 instances just in Potain alone.
Then you insult again and make it 8 instances âaloneâ just to continue arguing and being very VERY petty. Congrats, you succeeded at the last part.
Now to see if I can get this thread closed, we got our 2 cities in the same instance already and our RPers have their merchant guild story already planned out and set for when Saga ends unless they all complete the Saga quests before it ends.
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Thereâs only about 6 weeks left on Saga, and Funcom hasnât made any announcement that Iâm aware of with the fate of Saga guild cities, so Iâd be a bit cautious about building a Saga city beyond T1 that might be completely destroyed.
No itâs not changing. Proof:
I addressed the issue of people farming âyourâ instances in my first message. You just didnât read it the first time. Also, remember that the numbers I gave you are conservative estimates. The efficiency and dedication of your players isnât relevant to that particular issue.
And saying youâre reading only parts of what is actually written isnât insulting you. Itâs what is actually happening, as you just demonstrated it.
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I really hate to be that guy, but honestly, 20 people building 3 cities and getting renown 20 in a reasonable amount of time? And doing rp, raids and PvP too?
You are simply delusional mate!
You need all told:
Full T1 city roughly 1900 mats
Full T2 city roughly 35000 mats
Full T3 city roughly 450000 mats
So that is about 490 THOUSAND mats.
If you divide that by Nephs calculation on 170 mats/hour you get about 119 days of around the clock gathering.
Times threeâŠ
Yeah⊠good luck with that! 
Hey, if people want a big grind to sink their time into, so what?
Let them have their fun.
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I guess you are never going to read the words âTHEY DONT CAREâ and âBUILDING FASTER THAN THEY WANT TOâ or how 40 hours divided by 8 = 5 hours all while ignoring that I said 8 people that like to gather all day and said nothing about those that will do it only not grind hardcoreâŠjust keep on arguing mate. Whatever makes you believe that somehow your style of game play must be done by all.
Some people raid, and to them, raiding is end game.
Some people PvP, and to them, PvPing is end game.
Some people are gather/craftings, and to them, gathering and crafting is end game.
Some people are Role Players, and to them, anything can be end game.
Pick yours, enjoy it.
I never argued that the amount of materials was small, nor that gathering them all was easy and it is something they are looking forward to as they do in all games. So, thanks for the good luck.
Not building anything on Saga. Our plots are on Crom, T1 keeps are up so they are set in stone so to speak.
Thanks for the warning though 
I think that building their two (or three) cities will not take too long. The reknown gain will be slower than the city building, but thatâs part of the fun of building a guild.
@Epicmonies some info that may be helpful:
- the city gets decoration nodes at an early reknown level (2 I think) that can be built on as well ⊠can place certain plants on them as well as sculptures.
- at reknown 6, the city also gets centrepiece nodes to build on (even higher you get megalith nodes)
- all of these are set locations and also will have a direction the sculptures will face when placed, which we canât change.
- each city will have a circle of decoration and centrepiece nodes outside the city walls
- you can change what type of decoration you want to place on each even after a category is selected. You can destroy a decoration/centrepiece and replace it âŠnote: you do not get back the material when you remove/destroy them.
The recipes for these decorations and centrepieces are from a variety of places âŠsome purchased from npcs in your guild cities (more recipes appear at certain reknown levels), npcs in khitai lvl80, a lot in dungeons and raids, a couple from city quests that appear at particular reknown level âŠsome BoE - so can be sold/given to others, some BoP.
Many have a guild reknown level requirement to learn. But note, once learned you do not need to be in guild of that rank to use. I get the impression your community likes to do everything âin-houseâ, but just letting you know if your architects want to learn a recipe they could seek out a higher reknown guild that will let them join to get/learn recipes and then return to your guild.
As far as Iâm aware, the crafted sculptures and building blocks (eg girders, slabs) are not bound when you make them, so the architects can give to an officer with rank to place in the other city ⊠not sure how if thatâs the same for making buildings. Also, your community city designers might be able to find other players outside your community who can make the sculptures etc for themâŠcompletely up your community of course if they wish to do this.
The decorations and centrepieces I have found are harder to gather for than the city as they require a lot of the rare item drops (eg black silver, illustrium, soul wood). So those in your community who like to gather will have a lot they can focus on to get after/whilst they are gathering for the basic city âŠthey do not need to fear it will be finished too quickly for their taste.
There is a very nice site created by the guild Carnage that has pictures of the decorations.
http://infyrana.proboards.com/page/Decorations
The crafting spreadsheet linked earlier in post shows where they drop and what is needed to make them.
Reknown for making the sculptures/centrepieces is relatively small. But much higher for placing and I think not character bound but assigned to the guild artistry directlyâŠjust to keep in mind if you are trying to max reknown gain so you donât go over your guild cap and âwasteâ the points.
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