I swear the above is a different poster…although sounds like me.
If you’re looking for the person who destroyed the honour of Conan PVP, you’re barking up the wrong tree mate. I’ve never once done a single thing you just mentioned, and have tried to be an exemplar of fair play on every server I’ve ever been on. I’m just in favour of creative choices and options for the players in the game in general.
Maybe this particular choice, walling someone in, could be seen as harrassment; maybe not. But we don’t want to throw the baby out with the bathwater here.
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And this is something we all need as well in our discussions. For many years, FC has been radio silent on intent and now they are dropping what their vision is and enforcing that vision. Grace is definitely needed for…well…everyone as we adjust.
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Did you even read the first come messages in the start of the post? The wall was only up for a day. We attack the next day. The only reason a wall was placed was the scouting party was caught (seen) when looking for this needle in a haystack. They would have packed up the base and moved somewhere else. They are raiding as guillera warefare and I dont have time to spend another 7 hours looking for a base that will relocate. Especially when they were duping.
It is basically harrassment from them hitting every so often.
I wouldn’t hold your breath. They pretty much said they were done elaborating on the subject. They expressly said they might elaborate on other rules in the future… Who knows when. Given they felt the need to delete threads, group PMs and private PMs I wouldn’t categorize them as a paragon of transparency.
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It is funny they are tired of explaining when we would never thought that candles that far away is land claim abuse. They should implement rules by code if they are tired of explaining. This will stop questiojs because game will indicate it.
We won’t. On top of what @Ulyssi said above, I’ve seen this same pattern many times before:
- a new person X joins the community management team
- X engages with the community by replying to some posts
- since X is perceived as willing to communicate, more and more people start tagging X pretty much everywhere
- X gets tagged in controversial discussions and tries to participate
- the discussion, being controversial, gets ugly and eventually goes overboard
- posts are flagged and/or deleted, threads are locked and/or unlisted and/or deleted
- people get mad at Funcom in general and X in particular because of “censorship”
- X’s participation on the forums drops to minimal
- eventually most people stop tagging X
Both the community and Funcom are to blame for this pattern.
On the one hand, there’s a lot of toxicity in this community. Yeah, sure, we’ve all known for a long time that Internet can bring the worst out in people, but that’s no excuse, no reason to shrug and say “That’s just the way things are, grow a thicker skin and deal with it.”
On the other hand, Funcom employs community managers to manage the community. Part of that is to establish proper expectations and communicate clearly. That’s not working out here.
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It doesn´t matter for how long the wall was up. Its a behaviour that Funcom can´t and will allow or we would be back at point zero before the tos where implemented and people had to deal with giant walls of china everywhere. You know exactly that most people will not build their walls back and you are only lucky that this base you tried to wall in was that small otherwhise people here wouldn´t be that polite to you. Imaging 20 people on a server walling each other in. A normal sized base is a lot bigger then what you showed on your picture. And now imagine everybody on the server is doing that. No chance for Funcom to contain this in any way right now other then to forbid such behaviour and that is exactly what the tos was created for.
People can say the tos is not clear on some chases and I would agree. Also that some rules are way over the top, like the candle or pyramid examples we have seen and talked about in the past. But in general I believe that most people by now understand what the rules are. We can talk about the details but the general direction is clear.
Very wrong. that isbwhat is left of the pvp community. It is >75% of the pvp players that left due to broken pvp loops (max gear vs no gear, no real middle ground) along with exploits and 3rd party cheat tactics.
So what we have are the worst being a majority now.
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No not wrong. This toxic and exploitative behaviour didn´t started yesterday or a month or a year ago. It started apr. a month after the game came out. First weeks where ok, where everybody tried to figure things out. There was no wiki to explain recipes or anything else. So people where busy finding out the recipes esp. of steal. No climbing, so no shortcuts. On the other side of the river where the hyenas and they where strong and very deadly. People really had a hard time getting to the iron nodes. No iron in the starting area like today.
The first time conan got mass abused by people where when people figured out they can mass farm the explosive orbs. And from there it went downhill. The spear mechanic where you can use the spear to look through walls is something that was part of any raiding back then and still is, until today. Yes, a lot of people have quitted the game over the years but the abuse itself started a long time ago. The only difference to back then is, that the communtiy got more verbally toxic. Back then you played with a group, got raided from another and after the next wipe you played with the group that raided you. This is something that only rarely happens nowadays because people take everything very personal.
If the base was bigger like mine was then a different tactic is required. In addition, there was no way that a clan would be able to move that much loot or pick up the base in one day.
I am referring to bases over 10k foundation. It will be special for someone walling a big base like that when they clearly cannot leave easily.
Looking through walls is not consider high in my radar of oh noo they cant see through my foundation. It is called countering spy tactics. Even putting away thralls so they dont make noise is another one.
Maproom? Potion?
Yes it is doable. Why should it not? I can teleport myself out and die myself back in. I can also use thralls. I do not get that argumentation of yours. I am sorry. Walling in people to stop them transfering items around is nonsens.
I am referring to your logic that a wall around a big base would be consider mass land claim. There is no reason to do that to a big base because the size of the loot, they most likely have midnight potions, maproom. Why would anyone put a wall around a big base if they can leave? Your logic on tactics is horrible.
Thinking of putting a big wall around a big base. You were comparing me to other inexperience players.
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You said it yourself so why comparing my wall to a big base? When clearly they didnt have maproom, they might have midnight but unlikely. Due to the fact they only here to duplicate.
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You’re going to need to define ‘their vision of the game’. Because there is a lot of conflation on that topic in several threads.
If you’re going by the developer vision, I can easily tell you what that is. It encompasses pretty much everything the game engine is capable of and things it isn’t as they are continually creating new content, new features, and supporting mods to push it even further. Their developer-creative vision is only limited by the imagination.
If you’re talking about official servers. The above paragraph has some mitigation for reasons that are obvious, but conflated by many. Either out of ignorance, agenda, or other reasons. Here’s some official communications you and others are aware of (but maybe some aren’t):
The flexibility of the building system in Conan Exiles can allow for many different building strategies. Not all of them are conducive to fair play on the Funcom Official Servers.
- The Official Servers are a small part of Conan Exiles. The game was not developed with them in mind. We absolutely provide players with the building blocks to produce huge castles, foundation webs, stairs to the sky, and anything else you can imagine. So in a sense, we do advertise this kind of gameplay. The ruleset we use for the Official Servers is just the flavor of gameplay we want to provide to the community. I like to think there is server out there to please everyone.
We have these official statements that define that the vision for what they want to be possible in Conan Exiles and the experience that is provided on officials may not exactly be one in the same.
But to be honest, this isn’t restricted to just official servers. I know of a server that has a building limit that far exceeds anything you would ever experience on an official server. Here’s an example (one of the most extreme, I haven’t seen any more strict than this):
350 building pieces per person in a clan (solo counts as one). 100 placeables (crafting benches, torches, etc). 4 followers +1 per person in a clan. No outposts (must keep builds in single areas). No honeycombing. And various other limitations.
Why such a draconian measure? Because (at the time I last played there), it was full at 70/70 players at most hours of the day (maybe dipping to 50 players in off times). Just so everyone knows, a full server that is 70/70 does NOT merely have 70 players. It has anywhere from 400-500+ playing throughout a 24 hour period or throughout a 7 day week. That is potentially over a hundred clans. Well over a hundred areas having builds devoted to clans and individuals.
That’s a pretty hefty load and even running on some top end hardware is going to have to make some concessions.
I’ve also played on servers that allow pretty much an unlimited amount of building as long as you keep it ‘sane’. That’s a pretty vague rule but in practice it was anywhere between 20,000-50,000 building pieces and about a 100 followers per clan. I say in practice because that’s about what everyone used. Not really being told to limit themselves. Those servers usually have around 10-20 players online at a time, and have actual communities around 30-40 tops.
The biggest issue with server loads and rules that have to keep them playable is the number of total players not online, but having characters and having builds. An official server for example may have 5-10 players online at any given time. But could boast anywhere of a community of nearly a 100 or more players. With many of them logging in for about 10 minutes a week to refresh. You could argue there should be limits on this and I would agree, but that’s beyond this thread. We simply have to acknowledge their builds exist, and their builds have a load. And thus have to be accounted for.
So this is why official server rules differ from any vision a developer may have. It also differs from that of many of the most populated private servers. As I understand there are quite a few that boast player counts up to 80 now. The larger your community the more compromises in the form of limits you have.
So while the developers and even the community managers hosting events will boast, advertise, and even encourage the players to build stuff in the quarters of a million building pieces, you’re pretty much limited in smaller servers or single player when doing that.
You can build as big as you want and as grand as you want, anywhere you want, and in any amount you want in a singleplayer game. You can do so in a personal server with a few friends. If you want a moderate amount of people to play with, then you have to make sacrifices in how much you can build. And obviously when you run larger communities, then you have to sacrifice even more.
Suffice to say, when developing this game initially. I don’t believe the developers had it in mind that people be limited to (effectively) 20x20 areas. But given the partnership they made to promote the game. They had to go with the limits given, not the ones they wanted when it came to hosting servers.
And that’s just when considering resources available in the form of hardware, services provided by their partnerships, and by the software itself. There’s also practical limitations. The more players you have and the bigger they get, has a near exponential impact on the amount of space available for players to build in.
I’ve been on servers where I couldn’t expand a building simply because my neighbors on all sides where getting close through their own expansions who in turn were limited by theirs.
Building space is a concern as well as blocking content which is an issue every server has to contend with. Once the prime spots are taken, players have to get creative. And when they get creative, they start getting close to boss spawns and rare resources.
In some cases, sometimes the server owner has to make a judgement call and decide that some boss spawns simply have to give way to creativity. We did see some effort by FC to mitigate this with Siptah, at least in its first iteration. Placing all the important stuff in vaults that were in areas of the map not affected by landclaim, leaving the entire map as a buildable area. Players didn’t really like the emptiness of it however. 
But I’ve seen instances where some servers will simply move stuff off map and use pippi warps and portals to facilitate rare bosses outside of possible building areas. Just depends on how big the community is and how long they let the map go.
Some privates ‘cheat’ by not allowing the buildable area get too congested by wiping every 2-3 months. But obviously some players won’t like that. So concessions are made in other areas.
Unfortunately this sort of limits what FC can do with Exiled Lands. Its pretty much set in stone, and Siptah after its iterations are done are set in as well. But in my opinion, the map is large enough. Officials and privates both have tools in the form of mods or policies that make it work. At the end of the day the players simply need to choose the server with the functions they prefer. Rather than try to get the owners (private or FC) to match the policies to suit them.
I’m sure the ones writing the rules and enforcing them on officials would love to be able to lighten up on those rules if the game was capable of having single player limits (or the lack thereof), but that is unfortunately a fantasy for the foreseeable future, but most importantly for the present.
Now as it relates to this thread. This question needs to be asked. Are the walls meant to keep the people in for a siege, or to prevent them from building?
If its the latter, I’m sure its against the rules. If its to corral them in for raid time. Then its fine. But why use foundations instead of palisades? Foundations exert landclaim. Which is what Umborls mentioned in response to public builds.
Because let’s be honest, a siegework is a public build. A bridge helps the public cross an obstacle, a map room helps the public traverse the map, a well helps the public get something to drink. A siegework helps the public get exposed to PVP (which for PVPers is a positive thing).
In all cases, if they’re blocking third parties from building in the area, blocking resources, or generally getting in the way, then its probably not allowed. Which is why I brought up palisades. They can corral a target for the purposes of a siege, but do not exert landclaim. They also have the added bonus of being quite temporary and poofing not long after the siege is over, in the case they aren’t simply pulled up. Assuming they are not attached to any foundations.
More placeables or even a mechanic for temporary structures could definitely be considered. What I like about that idea is while it helps official players stay in accordance to the rules of the servers they play on, it gives private server players another tool to use for their stuff. Because like I exhibited above, these limitations apply, in some cases more so, on our servers as well. Especially on some of the most populated ones.
And I think most of us who play PVP on the regular can agree that more toys for PVP would be appreciated. We’ve only had orbs, jars, trebs, and arrows for years now (and avatars on and off). Wouldn’t mind seeing cauldrons get fixed and some new stuff to play with.
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I like this idea. I mean sandstone and flotsam are kind of temporary, but maybe something foundation-less or otherwise specifically (and visibly) temporary would be an interesting solution to lots of building issues. Raid-building, outposts, probably more.
Yes, extremely wrong! Only a very few and very immature players do those things. And even the ones who do are usually willing to admit it’s dickish and unacceptable - they just adapt the attitude of “F-it, I’m gonna do it anyway - try and catch me FC!!”. But like I say and lucky for us it’s a tiny minority of immature players.
If you just happen to have a few of these kinds of folks on your server or if you’re that way yourself, I’m sure it could seem otherwise though.
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Tele do me a favour pls. Don´t talk about stuff you have no glue about. Thanks.
Sometimes I wonder if people like you really ever played pvp on a busy server for more then a week or are you just trying to paint a different picture in Funcoms favour or do you just say such things because you wanna seem like someone that knows pvp? I don´t get it. I really don´t. It starts to make me more and more angry reading such posts. Neither of what you or bigcane said is true and everybody who is playing this game for real on a pvp server, and I don´t mean the usual 4 guys online at a time server, knows what I am talking about.
We did not spend the last couple of months talking about the state of pvp for nothing. We wouldn´t need a tos if people would behave the way they should be and not be toxic and exploitative to the core all the time. The whole: most people are harmeless talk and do nothing is nothing but pur lie and leads nowhere. Starts with a simple abuse giving teleports to people that do not have that obelisks and goes up to duping, scripting and all the other stupid s… people come up with. There is no, little abuse (like sharing the teleports) is not that bad as big abuse (duping). Abuse is abuse and it harms the game and the community. The pvp community doesn´t know any boundaries and is rotten to the core. There is no other word for it. People are neither honest to themselfs nor to others. Oh I would never do that. And one minute later they are sitting in their bases and well do it. And that is a problem. Not a new one but one that lead us where we are now. this hypocrisy of people. Reporting others for misconducts while they are not a slight better.
I can not discuss in one thread that I have a problem with the tos because I can not set 5 candles infront of my base and telling everybody at the same time: oh, people are not that bad in pvp. Well, If that where true, we wouldn´t need a tos that prevents you building 5 candles infront of your base because if Funcom would allow it it could get abused.
Yes, I have no glue about those things… How would that even work?
All seriousness aside, we each of us, only know what our experiences have taught us. My experiences have taught me that only a tiny minority of PVP players do or are “Abuse, duping, scripting, trolling, false reportings (sic), harrasment (sic).” and the ones who do so, admit they know it’s wrong and idiotic. The exception are people who themselves are rabidly idiotic and are unable to evaluate their own behavior. Like I said above, if you happen to have a few of these kinds of folks on your particular server or if you’re that way yourself, it MAY seem otherwise.
But yeah, virtually everyone knows and admits these things are dickish and unacceptable - whether they do them or not.
I’m not at all sorry that you don’t like hearing that. I’m also not sorry that you read complaints and critiques here on the forums and think that is how it is across the board and in general. One guy experiences what he thinks is “abuse, duping, scripting, trolling, false reporting, or harassment” and comes here to complain about it in the typical text-wall hyper-ranting that is so common on this forum. You read 5 or 10 such people (out of 50,000 users) and assume (falsely) that is typical or at all usual. It’s not. It’s quite rare on the foreign servers I’ve been on and it’s just about nonexistent on the Asian servers I frequent.
If you are on a server or two which are as you describe I would suggest leaving.