Sorcery - "new" point of view

Conan Exiles General Discussion Feedback
43

I think, for sorcery to work in Conan Exiles, it might have to work together with a bit more refined AI setting to the game. Where the NPC’s don’t always attack on sight, but might gather in places, fight each other and generally be a bit more involved than they currently are.

That way you could make it so that a religious display could gather more NPC’s around you and you wouldn’t have to make them thralls. Or that religious ceremony would do the same as with the Wheel of Pain. One could also implement a mild form of hypnotism as an option for thrall taking. The NPC’s would probably have to be alone though. Against players, it could be made into a brief closeup of the hypnotists eyes, as a form of flash-bang that distracts for a moment before it is shaken off (As Conan have been known to do in some cases).

Hallucination inducing vapor could also be a thing. A form of magical defense feature that could randomly change your direction when you enter it (Provided it blocked your sight). Something of that nature could also (Again) serve as an alternative to the wheel of pain. Using drugs instead of torture or religious sway. For necromancers, it could simply be to prepare a ritual to awaken the recently dead.

All sorts of lesser curses, miracles, small acts of magic could work as long as one avoids all the usual clicks with fantasy magic. Flashy have no place in the universe of Conan.

With all this in mind, I am strongly in favor of the Corruption system with this though. A user of magic should not be a warrior, able to use magic and blade in equal measure. A sorcerer should be dangerous because of the people that fear/worship them along with their magic. Needless to say, someone playing a sorcerer should have a difficult time moving around the world without help. To make make it so that the world doesn’t turn into a war of the witches, rather than an age of Barbarism.

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44

I completely disagree.
Sorcery in the Hyborean age was subtle & potent, but took time to cast. It also took a toll both mentally and physically… Going so far as to warp the flesh and minds of those who wielded it. Sorcery was also coveted; and spells could only be learned from Paranoid Religious sects and Cults/enclaves.

If Sorcery is implemented, I would expect it to be secondary to combat (maybe only setting off a single buff/ward or debuff/curse in an ambush.

Acquiring a spell would require either looting a Temple/Enclave or doing many favors in order to join one… both of which would require higher levels and/or time. Furthermore, certain temples only studies Specific types of magic… You wouldn’t find curses in a temple of Mitra.

I also doubt Sorcery is going to have a direct damage output, but have a more utility function to boost combat effectiveness… or to bolster fortress defenses (bind conjured imps/demons to scout ahead or guard a particular area).

In saying, all characters are going to be warriors first… Sorceries are most likely going to be tactical and timed choices to put combat in your favor (castable warpaint)… and something you’re going to have to bleed and work for. (that’s what I’m hoping for at least).
I picture Thulsa Doom… warrior priest/sorcerer. And if Sorceries are simply limited to buffs and debuffs; Then, It is perfectly reasonable that the two can cancel each other out and the players will be limited to their unaltered combat abilities.

A sorcerer who isn’t allowed to be a warrior would have to rely on sorcery… Which means having an allotment of spells he can manifest with an utterance and wave of his hand; right out of the start… Something that doesn’t fit the setting… ( You have to take solo play into consideration as well)

The Way I picture Hyborean magick is The caster sitting in a quiet space meditating for minutes at a time in order to cast a clairvoyant spell. A curse causing an opponent to fatigue faster; or making the ground shake beneath an invading forces’ feet in order to make them lose their footing and fall prone… either way, it takes some time and some concentration… But its not effective on a 1vs1 scale.

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45

I agree with your vision. Sorcery as utility. Let it be open to all player builds, rather than requiring a narrow character type. I want to see spells that I can utilize as an assassin, and as a warrior, and as a builder. It shouldn’t compete with any type of build, but rather augment them.

Clairvoyance would be one of the very best spells possible. Enter a trance under the spell of the Lotus, while your spirit can pass through walls, fly high into the air, and travel to different biomes to witness what others are doing.

Summoning demons would be second on my list. Conjuring bat-demons, and placing them under a spell so that you can control them, and soar above the desert wastes as a horror searching for its prey.

46

well yes, this are very nice ideas, but it could also be translated as “wall hack” and “fly hack”. I would prefer to stick with some “softer” version of conjuring and summoning (imps, skeletons, snakes,…)

47

Yea. anything else would require a separate combat mechanic and a separate perk tree that may overshadow, or be over shadowed by melee/archery combat. (something I doubt the developers want given the time they spent on the current combat mechanics).

with Sorcery you can probably expect:
-Damage and resistance augmentation (either direct or sub stats like poison or cold).
-Item manipulation. (enchantments will probably make weapons more durable and require fewer repairs … curses will probably decrease the benefits of food and healing)
-direct debuffs and buffs ( affects things like speed and stamina)

  • Thrall augmentations ( creation of werebeasts and undead, binding Demons to guard specific rooms)
    -fortress defense. (Conan was filled with stories of sorcerers creating towers “seemingly overnight” that were tied to their life and would collapse upon their death and made of fabled adamantine)

-might expect the conjuration of a special pet(familiar) you can remotely view from.

All… especially thrall and fortress augmentations spells may take lengthy rituals and hard-to-come-by ingredients.

Sorcery was prevalent… but it wasn’t spamable or easy to come by.

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48

Demon binding wouldn’t be a wall hack… If the AI was tweaked to be less aggressive… the materials hard and rare… the spell to acquire it even rarer… The chance that it may go wrong or give a mechanic that would allow another sorcerer to unbind it.

Augmented thralls would have to be re-broken. given the fact that its mind is now warped into something more feral… such things may be more then a sorcerer, especially a fledgling, can handle.

Might make raiding more humorous if bindings can backfire when raiding with a more knowledgeable sorcerer.

I would probably add in a limit ( a very low limit for stronger variants). undead and demons are unruly… And too many can literally come back to bite the aspiring Conjurist and Necromancer…

49

unfortunately issue with rare materials is, that now it has fixed spawn point, and who ever finds it first can build base around it, or close to it, and farm it as much as he/she like and create disbalance. This would become interesting with random respawn locations all over the map.

50

Such as an enemy spawn in a vague and large area. :wink:

to limit capitalization. ingredients… could be mundane or harvested from common fauna in random drops and then added and prepared with various other ingredients who’s properties wouldn’t register until you had studied the spell.

in this way a sorcerous spell would require a lot of wandering about for overlooked but abundant items… Only others who knew the spell would be looking for.

weaker spells may just take time and concentration. An incantation/ritual or the crafting of some fetish/totem or mix of both.

51

this would be too random and most people would not like me (including me). Anyway… when we take a look at current state of the game I HOPE that Funcom has no plans for adding sorcery any time soon… there is so much work to be done… this still feels like EA game :disappointed_relieved::cry:

52

Sorcery is a part of Conan universe. There are skeletons in Conan Exiles, so why necromancy can’t be added? Honestly, i don’t know why in a game that you can call a avatar of a deity people is against arcane magic. Call a avatar of a deity is a epic level thing in therms of D&D divine magic. While arcane magic on Conan Exiles is NON EXISTENT.

About the movie, Conan fought magicians who can shift into demon forms and shapeshift into a demon is at least mid tier magic in therms of D&D magic.

Conan vs a magician in a demon form

Using combat magic in a movie

About sorcerous societies on Conan universe

The Black Ring of Stygia
Many Stygian sorcerers are loosely organized in a brotherhood known as the Black Ring, whose seat of power is Kheshatta, the City of Magicians. In ancient days, Pteion, located in eastern Stygia, not far from the Taian border, was the former seat of the black magicians, but it was abandoned when the desert encroached upon it.

High-ranking members of the Black Ring are said to be able to kill with a touch, leaving a black handprint on the dead body.

The master of the Black Ring is Thoth-Amon, Prince of Magicians and High Priest of Set.

The Scarlet Circle of Khitai
Khitai is the stronghold of the world’s greatest wizards and masters of the eastern world. Its god-kings master the arcane mysteries of the Scarlet Circle, with its five elements: fire, bone, jade, blood and metal.

The supreme master of the Scarlet Circle is Yah Chieng of purple-towered Paikang, whose demons and sorceries are feared by all in the East. His greatest rival is Pra-Eun, the god-king of Kambuja.

The Black Seers of Yimsha
Mount Yimsha is one of the pre-eminent peaks in the Himelian Mountain region known as Ghulistan. It is the mountain stronghold of the Seers of the Black Circle, one of the oldest continuously existing groups of mages in the Hyborian Age world.

The Black Seers consist of a Master and several Adepts.

The White Hand of Hyperborea
Hyperborea is ruled by the White Hand, a coven of sorcerers not unlike the Black Ring of Stygia or the Scarlet Circle of Khitai. The White Hand “Witchmen” are the priests and priestesses of Louhi as well as accomplished sorcerers. Their magic focuses around the cold of their land and control of the dead. Hyperborean sorcerers are highly prized in the northern wilds, but they are little respected in Hyborian lands.

In addition to their sorcerous powers, the White Hand supports teams of assassins who travel for the Hand. These assassins wear black robes, capes and cowls and a white, flat mask which is transparent only to the wearer, giving them the appearance of having no face at all. They use a wooden baton tipped with two egg-sized metal spheres with which they strike nerve centers to immobilize, torment or kill their victims. These assassins are said to be extremely swift and skilled.
source Sorcerous Societies of the Hyborian Age

I already made a topic about that. In nutshell, i think that magic should be like AoC but more dangerous than AoC Magic like AoC. But more dangerous

Magic exists on Conan universe and a strong magician can rule over nations. It simple don’t come without any cost or risk. Sumon and try to enslave or bargain with demons in order to get arcane knowledge, fail in a ritual and lose control over your undeads, start to cast a spell, be interrupted and take the damage of your own spell… That is how magic should work IMHO

53

first of all… AVATARS, their size, power…that is just super stupid… Then to sorcery… yes, it is huge part of conans world and it should be implemented at some point… i just dont agree it is available to all players. that is stupid concept that does not fit to survival game

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54

Players at moment can summon a god’s avatar but can’t summon a weak devil like an imp…

Magic as i’ve said should be possible but dangerous. I will love to see demonology and necromancy in the game. Demonology should require rituals to summon demons than some will try dominate you, some will try fight, some will require human sacrifice, some will require your own life force and you can only use spells like flames of gehenna after a demon teaches you how to cast the spell. You can’t start the game knowing how to channel the power of hell. And if you are interrupted while casting, you will hit by your own hellflames. Casting while armored, or moving will increase the chance of failure drastically and unless you heavily specialize on it, your own magic will be deadly against you. And shapeshift magic like becoming a Lich or a Demon, should exist but require complex rituals and rare reagents.

Are you against this type of demonology? Is based on Age of Conan, but more deadly to fit more Conan Exiles lore.

55

it is great idea, but it is so rare… hard to imagine this kind of power in our hands. Lot of changes needs to be done to implement this correctly…starting with complex religion rework. Do i like idea of such sorcery? I DO! Do i belive this is going to happen, and if… will work correctly? NO CHANCE…! That is why i came with this topic.

56

The sorcery tht have more chance to be implemented is necromancy. First, there are already skeletons on the game. You only need to make then loyal to the “necromancer”, and add a building to create then. Will probably be necessary corruption to be able corrupt the living and create undead. In therms of combat, i will love to see a necromancer blade who draws the vitality when cut trough flesh and spells like Ice Strike requiring the lifeforce of the necromancer to be cast, instead of a traditional “mana bar”

This invocation creates a stream of cold that manifests into razor sharp slivers of ice inflicting cold damage on the target Ice Strike | AoCWiki | Fandom

If i remember correctly there are a ice map. And White Hand is vital part of Conan’s Lore.

The White Hand of Hyperborea
Hyperborea is ruled by the White Hand, a coven of sorcerers not unlike the Black Ring of Stygia or the Scarlet Circle of Khitai. The White Hand “Witchmen” are the priests and priestesses of Louhi as well as accomplished sorcerers. Their magic focuses around the cold of their land and control of the dead. Hyperborean sorcerers are highly prized in the northern wilds, but they are little respected in Hyborian lands.
source Sorcerous Societies of the Hyborian Age

Magic in Conan universe is very dangerous and most times, evil. Magicians aren’t ostracized and persecuted in many regions by no reason…

57

yea. I was thinking for the corruption system that:

  • All spells require a minimum requirement of corruption to cast.
  • Spells such as curses increase corruption
  • there is a safe threshold for how much Corruption a character can have.
  • going over this threshold causes some sort of negative effect. (cosmetic changes, Twisted limb that decrease combat movement, decreased vitality/HP, Can only gain nourishment from spoiled meat or the flesh of humanoid characters are just some examples)
  • going way over the limit risks death (mainly an issue for mid-high Sorceries that require a lot of corruption)
58

aye, that would be great. But again… when we take a look at current game mechanics it is almost safe to say that this is Funcoms experiment with Unreal 4. And that is OK, but i dont have high expectations anymore… sorcery system like this would require something more… maybe i am wrong (i hope i am) and FC will fix everything and implement great and balanced sorcery system. mean time… “Alchemy” would be great starting point for players and for current game lore. You started as Alchemyst, but later you discovered something else… You could resist it and stay among “normal ppl” or you could not resist the corruption and the way to sorcery is opened to you.

Now… yellow lotus potion…? you dont like your build… drink that ST and respec. But what if you got corrupted and became sorcerer? And what if you dont like it anymore? You just drink that ST and respec or you need to cure your self in some kind of ritual?

LOT OF WORK TO BE DONE TO MAKE IT LOOK GOOOD (not talking about making it look GREAT…)

59

yea, I admit I’m rather new to the game (had it less then a week) so I’m still not quite sure how Corruption works as is. (haven’t encountered a lot of it at the moment). look forward to seeing how its implemented. (and how its improved afterward lol)

as for it taking a lot of work… all the things I proposed would take a lot of Scripting. but apparently they already had Sorcery in the works…( its just not an implemented feature at the moment… hard to say how complex it is or will be)… hopefully they’re reading this thread and gathering ideas.

60

That is ok, WELLCOME! I am here from day 1 so I experienced lot of things already. I could see how Devs work and how long some changes can take. I watched almost every stream and notification, patch notes… what ever… So i think it is time to change this topic / voting to different question…

As i already mentioned after some time i believe Sorcery should be in game. I also believe that Alchemy should be reworked. We could also use new stat for Sorcery and/or Alchemy. In my opinion this two things could really work great together but also separately. I would love to be “The Alchemyst” since i dont really like the idea of necromancery or sorcery for my RP game style… So what do you think guys?

Should it coexist? Can you imagine this two things in action ingame?

  • Improved Alchemy - as mentioned above should exist in game and should also work ask PRECURSOR for sorcery.
  • Sorcery should be 100% stand alone mechanic.
  • Sorcery should not be in game at all.

0 voters

61

As far as i am personally concerned would prefer sorcery be its own thing and then alchemy be a separate thing entirely. I’ve always played a sorcerer or wizard in games that have allowed it because of their destructive potential and i much prefer shooting lightning from my finger tips than throwing an orb at someone. If i have to pick between the two however sorcery is the way to go.

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62

So in other words you don’t want us to be able to actually cast spells like a sorcerer, but just a fancy Orb thrower?

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