Treasures and PVP change request

With the new treasure system coming in, I would like to make the requests to change pvp a bit.

  1. Limit looting potential to treasure only. The rest (thralls, gear, resources, etc) are no longer items you can take but you can destroy and let loot bags decay.

  2. Clan treasure values are publicly visible via the player window and therefore creates a hierarchy of who has the most treasure.

This would bring purpose to PVP (outside of just smashing things just to smash things) that has been missing. It clearly shows who is winning vs losing and relays would targets should be. It also enhances the treasure system more and puts value on it vs stuff like dragon powder or alchemical base. And it stops giving rewards to those being toxic.

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I’ve had an idea I’ve been kinda refining over a few months along this lines. Or at least with a similar goal. The idea was that storage (chests, vaults, etc) could not be enclosed by walls and ceilings without a path leading outside the building via doors, gates, and/or hatches. And the reason being is that walls, floors, ceilings, and roofs would receive a massive buff across the board. Like you would still be able to blow through a wall, but it would take an inordinate amount of resources to do so.

This would cause raiders to prefer doors and gates as a means of entry. Leaving much of the base undamaged or lightly damaged and leveling a base would be right out. But defenders wouldn’t be able to abuse this by simply burying their treasure in construction hammer moveable walls.

This idea was formed long before treasure hoards were known, so it could be applied to them as well.

But if we’re only going to allow treasures to be looted, I do believe that some resources may need to be reclassed in some form. Resource raids should be a thing. And obviously I don’t mean stone and wood here. But definitely stuff like Alchemical Base, Dragonpowder, and many other multi-tier crafted resources used in high end equipment and such.

But as the evolution of my idea grew I came to realize that the current crafting table system might need an overhaul. I’m not a fan of having to load benches with material. From a PVE perspective, its cumbersome and extra steps. From a PVP perspective, it makes crafting tables targets. Crafting tables are expensive, have rare thralls in them, and in some builds… are a pain in the butt to place. So when one gets blown up, its no mystery to why the owner is frustrated. Depending on the thrall, that could be dozens to hundreds of hours of play just gone. And when one loses all their thralls like that, its barely one step above having to start a new character in its impact.

So definitely would like to have a system that makes these benches far more resilient if not immune to damage even. But they can no long store materials. Instead drawing it from local storage inventories. Combine this with more storage options, and we can have a really efficient crafting system that allows players to do what they really want to do. Play the game. And given how repairs work and the like in AoW this could lighten the sting of having to replace weapons and equipment. I mean if it was as simple to craft something as click the button once and not have run around getting mats for a dozen sub combines, then that make things more palatable. Not going to say no to side effects solving unrelated problems here.

But then you can kind of course those storage mediums into the hoard room. Thus providing wealth and power to those who can potentially craft high quality weapons and armors. Or at least add a bit to it.

This one I’m not so certain about. Like my biggest issue with it is it sort of breaks immersion a bit. Like we all have radars that show how much gold and silver each of us have. That’s a bit weird and a bit arcadey. But at the same time I don’t want to throw out the idea entirely either.

We don’t have wealth radars that tell us what everyone has. But at the same time wealth IS rather hard to hide. Wealthy people get well known, wealth gets displayed, even the most careful people tend to stand out. With that said a more abstract indicator might be better. So you can tell who the wealthiest people are on the server. But you won’t know exactly what they got. Even better if the system is relative to the wealth on the server. That way actual values are obscurred even more. You can tell if an opponent has less or more, but not what. You still get the information you need without it feeling like a high score at the arcade.

With that said… some may like to see the score and compare them. There’s nothing wrong with that, so perhaps a server setting to toggle that for those that want it. Just in case there’s a few servers out there that may want to have competitions for the largest hoards in a certain amount of time (just an idea, and something PVE servers could easily do).

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While this one usually just drowns all the loot in the Dagon Dungeon anyway, this one is a jerk.

The money pile has no real in game use.
Taking away the ability to smash and grab something utile (named crafters, gunpowder, Eldarium on the Exiled Lands) only further removes incentive to actual war for anything other than spite.

In a way, this one feels it moves the game even farther from any pretense of verisimilitude, where war is waged for control of land and resources, into some points based affair. Unless servers will periodically repair all the legendary weapons of the clan with the most “points”, why bother?

but with server resource rates the way they are, that’s exactly where we are now. Why waste time with explosives or god favor when I can just collect a literal full inventory of resources in about 2 days? The land claim system means that you can’t just take the land in one night. You don’t have the amount of time in the raid window to remove every single stone and the next night they can have their base up and working again. It stopped being functional when the harvest rates changed and so there is nothing functional about raiding anymore and more about fulfilling some latent arson fantasies and maybe some actual PVP but at worst…it’s just an exercise of grieving others in the guise of competitive play. At least with the treasure, there is a point to it and this is collect the treasure to keep top spot on the server. Now you can grind yourself to the top spot but you also can steal it and shoot way ahead. But this ranking has little to do with the game mechanics and more about status and reputation…which wasn’t that every PVPers point about it? That they want to show dominance in their skills. That has no logical in-game function either but we suspend belief there because its a PVP game. The treasure will give bonusses later but that doesn’t matter either…it’s can easily be seen as the metric of success for a pvp clan…either through their ability to grind and defend or their ability to raid and take.

To be fair, resource acquisition will taper a bit when Age of Sorcery closes.

As for Land claim seizure, that, THAT is what this one truly desires.
The ability to wrest control of a claim from it’s unworthy squatters.
That would give some teeth and motivation.

Perhaps something related to the Treasury can one day grow in that direction…

Not exactly… See, that’s the whole point of @erjoh 's suggestion and the reason I like it.
I’m not sure about the “preventing enemies from looting other stuff” part, that bit is less important and I’m sure some compromise can be had or that agenda “separated” if one chooses to pursue that…

However… the suggestion about the treasure is finally a step in the right direction.

I pointed this out a few times now, but… due to the freedoms this game offers, combined with a lack of actual purpose snowballed the PvP side of this game into absolute toxicity… and it’s getting worse and worse…
This lack of purpose is a very big part of it, since people are forced to come up with their own, often ridiculous and unsustainable, win conditions…
Currently if you ask 10 official PvP players what the goal of the game is… at least half of them will say in one form or another “to make other players quit the server…”
But at the same time, the same set of people are wondering… Why are official servers empty? :man_shrugging:

So in my opinion… giving them some purpose… even if it’s just a simple Leaderboard… for bragging rights of who owns the most treasure… is already a step in the right direction as it distracts from the “making people quit” win condition and maybe, just maybe could push people into slightly more productive playstyles.

While the treasure itself might be useless… as soon as you put it on a leaderboard and give it purpose… it immediately becomes “valuable”.

I think this is a great idea and more mechanics like this are needed in order to make the PvP side of this game sustainable long term.

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The ability to gloat over points is not a reliable way to detoxify a player base.
Leaderboards do nothing to improve dignity and honour.
But they certainly require more attention on the governing authority’s part.
Attention this one feels could be much better applied almost anywhere else.

Also, if you think the current level of complaint about slapdash administration and the report meta is bad, wait until we have the public ego board urinating petrol on that fire

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Because of all those hackers and cheaters, and because Funcom always makes bad decisions that are killing the game, or at least killing PVP. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

It would all be so much better if we got rid of those other people who stop at nothing to make people quit playing and just left people who will do their best to make people quit playing, but without crossing certain lines we can’t quite agree on :crazy_face:

Okay. That wasn’t nice. I’m kinda sorry for doing that, but it’s so damn perplexing for someone like me, who’s looking at the PVP servers “from the outside”.

These things are true, but what if you aim for something less ambitious than “dignity and honour”? What if you’re aiming to make “winning” mean anything other than making your “enemy” stop playing on the server?

Feel free to tell me to stay out of this, by the way. I know I’m an outsider and have no horse in the race, other than a curiosity about whether things that are keeping me away from PVP might be “fixed”.

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The current mechanic inhibits this. I would like to have the ability to steal structures…to take over a castle. I would say that building pieces like walls, ceilings, and foundations have no ownership themselves and only get assigned by the placeables around them. Therefore you can take over a castle when you remove all placeables (which I include doors, gates, and hatches) and free up the building components from the previous owners and ready for a new owner’s claim…but that’s probably never going to happen because some code back in 2016 will fry a GPU if you did that (or whatever the reason it can’t be done) …
new idea and this may be too “capture the flag” but what if the coffer bench is the one that dicates ownership of the building? meaning you have to have a coffer unit to have a base and if you have more than one base, you have to have additional coffer units. If an opponent is able to lay siege to your base and remove the coffer, then they can claim the entire base as theirs by adding their own coffer

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on my map (which at the pace o
I am moving will be out in the year 3000 :slight_smile: ), I am taking this 1 step further.

  1. Very minamal farming raw mats, meaning some forrest areas are static meshes to navigate.
  2. Limit building areas to about 30% of map.
  3. 3 type of building areas, very small 2x2x2 area for a bedroll type nomad place, Wall areas around Villages amd small npc camos that have loot chest with building materials, and alpha base lications for those that want to tru and hoard.

The idea is, as a pvper, i can blow thru your walled in resource villages as a nomadic player to build gear fpr foghting, or if i am in a clan, build an alpha base (20x20x15) in areas close to dungeons etc to try and control that area.

And also no obelisks, and may blacklist teleporters. Traveling the map is part of pvp imo. And some unclimeable rock faces etc.

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Funcom could create a foundation or a something with a fake hatch and name it basement vault. It would simulate an entry to an imaginary space. All benches within a certain radius would get materials directly from it. Give it 500 slots if needed. . On pvp, you would know clearly what to defend and what to attack.
We all know chests are a problem when it comes to performance. This would eliminate them or cut down their number drastically. The current vault is MASSIVE, not really practical. It fills up very fast.
Join this to your ideas and we might have something interesting going.

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i love the idea and personaly i believe that we are heading to this direction where treasure chambers will be the “goal” in pvp servers, but i still find the flag idea of @CodeMage more correct! The reason is simple, the treasure chamber as it is now don’t even have to be on your main base. Which means that it’s going to be used as a bate from bloodthirsty clans to get you on your knees because you dared to steal them and the answer will be swift and direct. But in the flag system, you couldn’t build a treasure chamber out of your base and probably you would got an answer but not so swift.
Conan exiles pvp is an anarchy style, you don’t have tactic wars, no conversations either agreements, you just decide to raid and hit.
Now imagine a pvp server works as a pve server with purges. What i mean is an old idea of yours @erjoh that may find flesh and bones after all. Pve building in a pvp server untouchable until the owners decide that they are ready for war. The number of their treasure will be visible in the proclaim for a pvp war and the rest of clans will decide if they wish to hit for the amount you have in your treasury. Now the clan that will accept war with you will define your alliance needs. For example if you play solo and the clan that agreed to hit you has 10 persons then the system will allow alliances but under a percentage of your treasury.
This way the anarchy will be minimized and people would think more seriously to play in pvp servers. The wars will demand strategy and preparation.
Still, i don’t believe that the pvp community will be thrilled by it, so i’ll stop dreaming here :rofl:.

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Some very interesting stuff in your post, @stelagel !

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Yep but the reason that limit is there is to force the PVP players to acknowledge the true goal is the treasure and not the other items. Otherwise they will flat out ignore the intent and keep playing their style and the hell with that ‘useless’ treasure. Give it meaning by taking away everything else’s with respect to raiding.

I totally forgot about that! TY for reminding me.

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I once played a game where if you attacked someone smaller, they had a moral bonus, meaning their units were stronger. This used to even the battlefield a bit.
But I can see a number of ways this could be abused.
We sure abused the crap out of it, attacking with satelite smaller clans to break their defrenses and only then hitting them without our full force. No bonus could save them then. That’s why I don’t even suggest this idea on this game.

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