I can understand lowering the PvP attributes of a high level PvE weapon or armor. That’s balancing and I would still go after those rewards, but making it totally worthless for PvP with a -500 PvP to-hit rating or other game-breaking stat makes it not worth the time to acquire for me. So while I might do Onslaught every once in awhile the end rewards are not compelling to me.
Same with T-6, broken game, I don’t need the T-6 stuff to PvE in and if it is purposely broken for PvP then you reach a dead end. But of course you need to have “EXP” to get on a T-6 team, no experience in the dungeon means you don’t get in anyway. I think the word I am looking for here is ennui.
I have been subbed since May 2008, playing some characters from June 2008 currently.
You shouldn’t need a carrot on a stick to make you want to do content. If you enjoy the content, play it. If you don’t, do not do it. Adding ridiculous rewards and benefits that force everyone to do the content that you want to do, in order to stay competitive, is what made AoC start hemorrhaging players back in the gem days, 1.05, Bori, and Khitai.
What your post basically conveys is that you want an advantage over players in PvP because you can complete PvE encounters. I don’t think I should start with an extra SCV in Starcraft because I completed the campaigns on Brutal, or an extra rook in chess because I can defeat the AI.
the -pvp hit rating is the only reasonable -pvp stat, with -pvp armor and -pvp prot maybe.
-combat rating and -magic are a joke in my opinion and should be made more -pvp hit rating.
I want to expand on @MyStygga s post by saying yeah bro if you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen if you want to earn PVP gear do PVP The days of doing PVE to excel in PVP are over!!
Well I mean let’s be real we need RF rings so we have to do PVE to be competitive in that regard…
I welcome these negative PVP stats and they need to increase those negative PVP stats!
There’s still time to be part of the upcoming series.
Hyborian Tales
Casting call: need someone who can sound like a mischievous middle 20s male. Must be able to giggle mischievously. Contact me on discord to be considered.
You already have the advantage over pvpers with some t4,t5 and t6 gear. Now you cry over the weapons…
In my point of view it should be simple, Pvegear for pve content and pvpgear for pvp content.
I’m actually sad that all this pvegear have destroyed pvp for so long.
Add -stats on t4,t5 and rf rings and wb cloak.
Rest of imbalance comes from classes, the fact that conq has 6k more armor than clothies, but 20 dps less and 80 crit chance is not enough, considering how much crit chance the class gets from pretty much passive buffs.
My conq runs with about 41 crit chance, with just the green crit pot from armory. Granted that is with rf rings, but even then the crit chance should be dropped to be somewhere around 15% , and that does not just go for conq but for many other classes… meh just generally hate the whole “random resist” and “crit chance” meta we have going on
Lets also address the issue that tanks can be in frenzy while maintaining about 30% prot
Going to frenzy should have higher penalties from it
Frenzy should probably be -100% invuls like it used to be (and maybe slightly higher damage boost IDK). But DTs and conqs can still do insane damage in neutral or def stance anyway so that does not solve much.
Class balance isn’t too horrible in pvp anyway (but yes, tanks have been OP for a very long time) but it’s a complicated subject and I’d rather Funcom focus on simple, realistic things that are not risky or controversial. Negative pvp stats on some pve items is something they have already started doing and they could could really just add a few 0s here and there and improve the pvp quite a lot. And preferrably add them on rf/chaos tank rings too.
Once we have fixed the gear disparities and have everyone in full pvp gear only, it will also be much easier to judge the class balance properly.
The premades we did with everyone in t1 pvp gear and no runes were very interesting. But I’m not gonna draw too many conclusions from those because we did not do nearly enough of them. It did make tanks much easier to burn for example but guard was completely busted since it was not much easier to burn than in the current meta (guard hits diminishing returns easily on mitigation numbers and everyone does less damage in t1).
never understood why theres gear progression systems to pvp. Should rather be a default that everyone has the same strength of equipment. I dont know how t6 gear balances to pvp gear in pvp but it should be lower than pvp t3. But in the best of worlds you would get pvp t2 or t3 on claim and pve gear would be unusable
Originally it was like that. Pve gear only had effect on pve, meant nothing in pvp. Gaute left, Craig took over, proclaimed wow was the best game ever, then converted aoc from a skill based to a gear based game in 1.5.
History lesson of the day.
Ps. And honestly pvp was a blast before gear watered it down
PVP gear was completly thou, for anyone that was not a tank for a long time,
like had no damage at all, you were better off running in khitai gear and tier 2 raid weapon than pvp 10 gear.
Grind mini games for 2 years to get pvp 10 weapon… that is worse than t2 raid one… mmkay then
T6 armour gives quite more damage, but makes you more vulnerable to magic. I was disappointed when T6 weapons were useless for PvP due to the negative hit rating, because I appreciate new weapon models to use, and I’ve thought the same about Onslaught weapons. T6 armour should have -hit rating too, and then I agree with everything else posted here, leading to PvP restricted to PvP gear.
Essentially t6 gear gives 3.5 stacks of the “torment” debuff for protection to anybody you attack while wearing the gear. This leads to a roughly 10-20% damage increase on completely maxed out characters. It is more significant when a character already has debuffs, or when attacking characters that are not totally maxed out, because of the diminishing returns on protection – the lower a targets protection, the more additional spell pen adds. It can snowball really hard and lead to demos and necros critting tanks in D stance for crazy amounts of damage. I think my pvp5 conq in defensive stance has been hit by naked ice strikes for 3.5k. It’s pretty obvious it’s just a complete upgrade on sin, as it gives more damage + armor + penetration + evade chance than the pvp set. I do not see pvp10 gear sins dropping 7k poop bombs, or triple proc 7.5k face stabs (not including combo damage).
On some classes (namely necro, demo, and sin), the -pvp protection stat is a joke because 600 prot is laughable when you have a staff with 500 protection and each ring giving 260, a high base immunity to magic from intelligence, or immunity to magic up half the time.
In group pvp, if there are not many ToS/Demo running around, I’m willing to bet that most tanks wouldn’t give a flying f*** about losing 600 protection either, considering I think classes like brute conq with t6 have a higher hp pool, which means their self heal heals more than while using the pvp set, while gaining a free 2 torments worth of armor pen and increased crit.
tl;dr: imo t6 is usually a straight upgrade for necro, demo, sin. in certain conditions, it is superior on guard/conq/dt.
I don’t know if -pvp hit rating is that great of a way to balance it. As shown by the new onslaught weapons, casters really don’t care about hit rating, and can usually get away with -1000 without a problem. That said, I’d love to see it implemented on the armor anyway .
-hit rating can work for casters too but the numbers just need be way higher than a mere -1000 so that we go far enough in the negative. Like, just add a 0 and you won’t land a single spell anymore on a lvl 80 character.
The minus prot/armour could have been used to make t6 an “alternative gear set” with tradeoffs* but Funcom actually did try to reduce the pvp damage on it so that was apparently not their intention. They just have no clue how weak combat rating is (it would take an insane number for it to mitigate the penetration buff). And well, same thing goes for magic damage although it’s much easier to see the impact of magic damage at least - but again, the debuff is far too weak on t6 gear (and t5 runes too, for that matter).
*this gear is locked behind raiding t6 which a lot of pvpers will never do (and it only increases the power gap for new players/fresh characters) so obviously not actually a good idea. Having different pvp armour sets with a different stat focus would be totally awesome though, “horizontal” progression is fun in pvp games, opening more options for viable classes, specs, playstyles.
Honestly the few times i see people playing in full t6 in minis, they just melt from being so squishy. Even what would be the best class, sin loses half his hp if a pillar crits on them. Don’t think i’ve seen demos using it but can see why it would work, but on necro it seems like a really bad idea. A class that relies on constant life leeching to use something that makes so much squishier doesn’t seem very smart.
What I could argue where t6 gear shines is using some individual pieces, like using chest and helm on hox, or something like chest and legs on bs or something like conq. Because in those cases 99% of the time the downsides are quite a bit less than the upsides.
Also would be funny to see try to play in full t6 in premades, something tells me they will switch to pvp gear very fast.
thou, for anyone that was not a tank for a long time,
