Bow still can 1-2 shot, Horses can still 1 shot. and it needs patched with more broken pvp

That is pretty interesting. Reminds me of when you could craft 100% pen arrows and auto lock people down with lights. So do they just all run bow v bow then, or are they banning them?

Bows shooting through shields is either a bug or lag, you guys are super sensitive on this shield point lol. I promise I feel you man, I have no doubt you guys have play tested the crap out of counters and the shield is not sufficient alone for dealing with the bow. However, it is still a soft counter - if you hold up your shield and they hit it they arent supposed to do damage to you. That being said I personally do agree with you the bow needs addressing, id just rather see the cc go and the damage stay. I think you wanted the opposite.

It was, in fact, the very last recommended counter. Until Funcom wants to change the way vanilla works offline raiding is a part of the game. Whether you or I like that has no bearing on what the reality of offical CE is. It therefore HAS to be considered in the over all balance of the game. If people dont like that please make a post about it, ill be the first to upvote you.

I thought this was against ToS? If not it should be, idk why land claim spam on PvE would be treated different than anywhere else.

Foundation spam isn’t against the rules unless it’s literally done to block spawn or cut off resources, but it’s still toxic to build a line of foundations across the map just so you don’t have to actually walk to your bases to reset them.

If you haven’t seen the massive complaints about this I’m not sure what to tell you?

Of course is besides the point, as “offline raid them to counter bows” isn’t actually a counter to bows. Hide until they go away isn’t a counter, and it wouldn’t say anything about the balance of the weapon regardless of whether you hide successfully

You seem to be claiming a weapon should be balanced by an unrelated game factor. Offline raiding being a counter to archers would, among other things, imply that archers couldn’t just offline raid you

As it would happen Reaper I previously suggested the modes in Conan Exiles should be balanced separately. Should you take a peek, you wil see just how well received the idea was, with over 75% of the community supporting the motion. And from my own perspective it neither mode would lose from such a direction.

My suspicion though, which is also what a number of our more technically minded members within affirmed, is that it would likely be just too much work, if it is even within the realms of possibility.

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It’s certainly possible and would be really simple to do from a technical standpoint. You’d basically need to add flags to players that limit or add certain aspects

Flags could be persistent from one mode to another, as they would have literally no effect on PVE since you’re never attacking anything that would have the player flag

This would have the added benefit of also not effecting the PvE element of a PvP or PvPC servers.

Of course just because something is simple doesn’t mean that it’s easy, and even if it were easy that doesn’t mean FC would do it

I would have to just take your word for that OctaviousWrex, because I have an utterly poor understanding of the technical side of programming. But it would certainly be nice if it its possible.

Official Servers - ToCaP : * Abuse of the claim system (claim spam) where blocks are placed for no other purpose than to prevent other player’s access to resources and building spots.

I am aware. It is against ToS, I dont see why it wouldnt be on PvE. Report it when you find it.

Allow me to clarify. My claim that avoidance is a counter to any style of play is a commentary on the greater balance of official CE. Individual weapon balance is at the very low low end of things that would need to change to make vanilla CE balanced. Perhaps I would have been better served by saying that instead. Or more plainly, complaints about weapons are pointless when you can raided while at work/sleeping.

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This seems a lot like gatekeeping and telling other players they’re not to ask for changes that don’t fit your personal sense.

I don’t think that’s your intention, but if you don’t care about weapon balance, as you claim, why would you be spending so much time arguing about something that you don’t care about and “doesn’t matter”?

As I said way back, offline raid protection needs to be brought to official servers. Then it will actually start to matter for official PvPers how the weapons are balanced. I do appreciate that it matters to private PvPers. I guess that’s where all the crankiness in this thread is coming from - we all have our own agendas.

If that were the only thing I had to say on the topic, maybe. Truth is I have done my best to encourage discussion here, only once did I resort to mild sarcasm (and it was swiftly hidden by the community). I guess I disagree that being willing to recognize the greater situation surrounding our discussion here is gatekeeping and I only brought it up in a passing post on-topic point remark. Also, I have at many points encouraged opinions and directly asked for them.

I do care about weapon balance and I value my time. I dont think recognizing the scale of our conversation here and pointing it out in passing negates any of that.

What are your actual arguments about keeping the bow as is? Do you think it should protect the user from knockdown when he is charging a shot? Do you think it should also be able to knock people down with a charged shot? Do you think they should be able to charge a shot while rolling?

What do you see as the drawbacks that balance the bow against other weapons to allow it all those advantages and still be able to hit at a distance, while suffering no disadvantage when the gap is closed

I know there are plenty of issues with other aspects of the game, but this thread was pretty specific in its focus, and offline raiding isn’t the focus.

If you said that one type of food was too strong compared to every type of food and I counter by saying food strength doesn’t matter because someone can just steal your food that doesn’t actually address the balance of the food

I would encourage you to go back through and read. You will find my personal opinions on the balance of the bow, a collection of arguments from the thread as to why outright nerfing could be problematic, and useful back and forth dialogue regarding those points.

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I’ve been in this tread, I’ve read the arguments on both sides as well the avalanche of posts in the tread that aren’t actually addressing the topic but just complaining about game changes in general

If it’s not too much trouble to repeat your views even on a condensed version I would much appreciate it, as I don’t want to reread hundred of posts of people insulting each other for liking the wrong game type (both pvpers and PvE players on this site do this a lot)

I’m sure I read what you said earlier but would love a chance to see them again without wading through all of that, especially if you think I’ve misinterpreted your point of view

The bow and Lance need damage and CC nerfs to make them counterable… a bow shouldn’t do more damage than melee weapons in melee range and be unstaggerable… its just not a fair mechanic. But the lag is also a factor that makes the game weapons more unbalanced. Look at a video from one of my buddies on his server Peak conan performance

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Sure, respectfulness should begat respect.

My personal opinion is that the bow should not both be a high damage weapon and a heavy cc tool. I think TheReaperofChess has the right of it in that it just does too much too well. I would like to see its ability to knock down and be unstaggerable while charging removed. Also, im going to assume charging shots while rolling is a bug, it should be fixed - if its intended it also should be removed. My take away is that the pvp community they represent would rather the bow keeps its cc and lose damage and be relegated to its old teamfight facilitating role. I disgaree with this because I dont see that role as being valuable to most CE players ( other Private PvP, Official PvP & PvE servers), while a pure damage bow is.

That being said, even a nerf/rework I agree with will have ramifications for all types of players. Their play should be considered and valued equally. We should also quantify the circumstances by where this data is coming from (in this case hardcore pvp servers) and compare it to the circumstances of the majority (not all problems of the harcore pvp servers are transferable 1:1 to CE in general). There were a few reasonable arguments that I noted in the thread (that doesnt mean I agree with them):

  • There exists counters to the bow in vanilla CE that go underutilized by the harcore pvp servers (there has been good and bad back and forth on this). They were cover, shields, horses, your own bow, and engaging in combat in ways not allowed on those servers.
  • If the bow is so broken, why does the hardcore pvp community not ban them in their circles? They do so with horses. Could it be the case that there is not an actual consensus yet?

Despite the nastiness there has been some really valuable input here I think, and it would be worth a proper read.

lol that one hurts in the soul. Didnt lances used to break on first hit at some point or am I making that up? They should reconsider that.

That would be the best solution, I think. I’m pretty sure they won’t do it, though, because it would double the balancing work that they would have to do. Instead of one set of values, they would have to work on two. It’s easier to keep fiddling and tweaking one set of values, even though it’s pretty much guaranteed it’ll never work properly for both communities.

Yeah, this is why I generally try not to talk about how I think PVP should go. Believe me, I understand it’s a different skill set and I respect that. When I offer feedback, I try to make it clear why I’m doing it and what my bias is. And even despite that, there’s always at least one special person who thinks he’s the God’s gift to the community and everyone else needs to shut up when he talks :stuck_out_tongue:

Yeah, even without playing PVP it was obvious that LBS was completely broken. Hell, I could give it to a thrall to hold and it would go to full health in less than a minute. That means LBS broke even PVE.

It’s not so much that it got nerfed, it’s that it became a freaking paperweight after the nerf. Seriously, it’s utterly useless. After spending countless hours trying to get a couple of them, it was a kick in the nuts to see what they did to it.

And that’s why I argue about nerfs. Like I said, it’s not the other players’ fault that Funcom chose to nerf things in that specific way. But if nobody pipes up and tries to offer different solutions, we might end up with a nerf that, for example, turns the Reach of the Red Mother into another paperweight. I really don’t want that.

It is against the rules, but they don’t do anything about it. At this point, it’s been actually proven they don’t. I’m starting to be nostalgic about the “bad old days” before the new rules. At least back then you could try to nip the whole thing in the bud using the same kind of tactics against the trolls. Nowadays, Funcom doesn’t do much about it, but you still might get banned if you try to take things into your hands…

Yeah, that sums it up. It’s doable, but they won’t want to spend double the time balancing things, especially because even then it would be impossible to satisfy everyone :stuck_out_tongue:

Get over yourself. I merely mentioned you in a conversation with someone else. I don’t care what you think about it. If you think I mentioned you because I had a burning desire to continue listening to your personal attacks, you have an overinflated idea of your importance.

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I have read it, and have been involved in the conversation for quite a long time, I just couldn’t remember who was who when it came to some points made and have tried to go through it again but at a certain point hundreds of posts just get to be too much to keep track of, especially with all the branches and sub conversation

Thanks for repeating this stuff, as it clears up quite a bit. I remember these posts and think they have some really good points

I think that some of these counters aren’t so much counter as they are just avoiding the situation. They are all helpful and good advice

Taking cover for example. I’m in cover, cool, now I’m behind this rock and he can’t shoot me. But I can’t just stay behind this rock forever, and if I do I haven’t actually countered his bow, I’ve just canceled the encounter. Maybe he’ll get bored and wander off, or run up to me and fight me in melee range. Or maybe he’ll just stay there until I go insane and wait for me to move or log out

It’s equivalent to running away, which I can respect, running away is typically my go to move in PvP especially if hiding or negotiations aren’t options😝 but I’m also not good at PvP

I’ve actually seen several people suggest using the bow with blunt arrows to defeat horsemen on Reddit, so I’m not sure that the horse counter would work great? It’s an angle I’ve only recently seen personally though so I have no idea how horse vs archer would play out regularly between two high skill player and would be interested to hear more about it

Saying to use your own bow to counter an enemy bow is a legitimate tactic, it just doesn’t tell us anything about balance, because two of the same thing will be the same

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This is a surprisingly universal problem with game companies. Rather than making a small adjustment to one part of weapon or power they tend to make a sweeping change that effects several aspects at once and almost always swings it way too far the other direction

And then they leave it broken for years

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Hi! You both should stop responding to each other. Thanks!

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May I recommend some jumper cables? :smiley:

image

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I think you bring up some valid points, I can add a little bit from my personal experience here. Cover doesnt always have to be so static, much like we use pocket palisades to counter horses they can function as movable cover. You can give them the old “fortnite special” and use foundations in the same way.

The idea behind the blunted arrows ( javs too) is that you will dismount faster with stamina damage. Horse v archer (mounted or foot) will always come down to whether or not the horseman can close the gap without being dismounted ( which depends on positioning, terrain, skill and equipment), if they can they have an advantage usually.

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