Now I feel and do hope I am wrong on this but way I see Conan as geared based pve that offers pvp but not competitive.
Diablo 3 has pvp but since your gear are over powered that pvp is pointless and feel that is where Conan is at.
Can it be fixed I don’t know.
What’s fastest armor and best weapon from scratch can easily achieved.
Remember you have no thrall and no one assist you and you have 5 hours at best to be ready.
Can it be done if it can’t then Conan has fallen into pit of pve and that killed it. Before any pve gets mad at that statement reason pve kills game because forces develop make content it’s faster part and they follow trend get rewards of better stuff which then makes pvp one sided.
I bet if I asked what is pvp I would get 15 different answers by Monday. If we are to talk about the status of PvP, I believe we need to have a common definition.
Pvp in 1 vs 1 in standard one would have low end gear vs highest end gear.
Low end means something easy obtain with low risk and time. This be more lines of harden steel weapons. Which both can be easily obtain in couple hours.
Competitive terms that even if player has advantage does not determine outcome.
If answer is best gear then game can not be pvp it just has pvp element since most gear is based off pve.
But what if PVP is a complex thing that resists a simple definition? It can be unhelpful to always try and boil things down to a simple answer. Maybe it would be better to define which aspect of PVP we want to improve, and then discuss that. So how about in this case: we forget about building, raiding, etc. That’ll just distract and that stuff can be discussd in it’s own thread (there’s lots of them). PVP in the context of this thread means players avatars fighting one another.
In that context I think Styker is 100% spot on. Competitive PVP can’t exist when power (the ability to win a fight) comes from gear got through PVE grinding.
Some possible solutions:
Increase player health by 500-1000. This makes fights last longer and gives a bigger window for skill to trump gear. It would affect lots of other things though.
Nerf gear. Same as above.
Reduce the power spread between tiers of gear. Maybe increase the damage of lesser weapons, and reduce armour and vault gear buffs. I like this one because you can scrounge up an ancient khopesh and some medium armour and go toe to toe with a blinged out warrior. It also has minimal impact on PVE.
The best way to have proper PVP is to play on a server with a ruleset you wish. If you’re not doing that, then you’re not going to have any decent PVP.
Any suggestion made outside of that is always going to rub someone the wrong way. There literally is a server for everyone and every playstyle.
I don’t agree with that. For one thing I like the official PVP server settings, they’re fine (except for visible health bars being an option). Suggesting that the solution for “proper” PVP is a private duel server or something is unsatisfying to the many PVP players who want precisely the chaos, the raw-ness and uncertainty of official PVP. The server type isn’t the problem.
The problem is that PVP fights in this game are overwhelmingly won by the person who has the best gear, thrall and buffs. It’s always leaned that way and that’s fine I guess. But a couple of years ago I used to be able to take people on asymmetrically and sometimes win, and now I can’t. Ever. What we need is for PVP fighting to be an exciting option from the start and for the whole game, not just an option for endgame min-maxing farmers.
Here is the devil’s advocate though…the PvP has NEVER been about players but about raiding in CE. PvP vs PvE-c…what’s the difference? Building damage. That is what designates pvp in Conan. Everything else is a variant of PvE. So are we really talking about the same thing here? Have we misunderstood Conan this entire time? Conan never claimed to be competitive or fair. This can only be done with wipes.
Every criticism I am leveling here can be applied to PVE-C. Which incidentally people only think of as a PVE variant because it’s in the name. PVP could just as easily be called PVE-R(aid). And again, I’m talking about players fighting each other and how to make it a more fun experience that people actually want to do. Raiding is another topic. For what it’s worth I’d be fine with wipes (yes, I said it). But to achieve what I want they aren’t required. What about option 3 in my post above?
edit: incidentally, PVE-C would be my preferred mode of play except I’ve tried it and people are even less bold than in PVP. And there’s lots of building abuses that you can’t even blow up
With leveling or without (start at 60 after transfer for example)?
Official server rates?
I would say Star Metal gear is obtainable in that time period. With a T1 or T2 (don’t know if tamable in that time) you can increase your crafted weapon damage by a bit.
But I would go for the ancient pike, which has bugged damage and more than star metal.
But keep in mind, that “competetive” means that you are matched against players with similar skill. This requires a matchmaking system, which Conan does not have.
I think what @Styker was saying is that skill doesn’t even come into it. That’s the problem. The endgame gear brings such an advantage over early game gear that someone who is good at the PVE farming and crafting, decked out with the best stuff ,will always beat someone with simple gear. Even if the second person practices PVP fighting a lot. That’s why they’re saying
I’m curious what you think of this @SirDaveWolf. It seems true in my experience.
Well OK. But I can’t see what that has to do with the problem of PVE-obtained gear and buffs being so powerful that they completely determine the outcome of PVP fights. Which is what the OP is talking about.
I don’t think you understand what I trying to point out. FC doesn’t see pvp the same as you and so you have to get what their vision of PvP. This may be perfectly what they expected and designed to be. For instance I could equally say there is benefits to equipment based advantage combat. This opens up any one can get a clear advantage to take the server if they can grind out the stuff. It doesn’t take the skill of some CE martial art expert that has the time to become Bruce Lee. The player vs player aspect is more about destroying each others bases in their eyes. I mean they dictated the designations and sure we can just discount it as word choices but it definitely shows how they view what pvp is.
Ah OK I get what you’re saying. And it’s a fair point. I can’t speak for others but I’m not suggesting PVP combat be changed drastically to fit my vision - just have the balance skewed back just a little, so that gear isn’t everything.
I think I do. If all that’s wanted is just PVP. But I don’t think the game is designed for anything even close to that. The closest example I can think of of pure PVP the way I like it, would be something like the old Rocket Arena mod for Quake III Arena “RA2” - or even the new one. Even modern MMOs like ESO which dedicate areas of their server and map to be solely PVP fall pretty short with all the traveling, extraneous and varied gear, character setup and so on. And ESO tries really hard to focuses as much as possible on “exclusive PVP” in those PVP areas… something Official Server CE will never be able to achieve without a complete remake. Modern Warfare, again is a pretty good example of what most people including myself, think of when thinking about “what is PvP”…
So yeah, if there isn’t something (a rule set or set of mods, etc.) focusing everyone in a somewhat similar way then a lot of players are going to be dissatisfied or lose interest. That’s one point that 2 hour YouTube gets right… CE is NOT a game designed around the concept of PvP as most gamers know and love it. It’s a build and survive sandbox designed for long play - mostly including PvE activities - with some elements of PvP added.
Agree with the balance is needed. I don’t think it would be that hard to do as it is equipment based do tweaks to the equipment could help solve it. What I would prefer is design done with the concepts of strength and weakness with armor and weapons. When designing weapons, where does it shine and where can it be neutralized?
When there is that many players online, the PVE content turns into PVP content because you are dealing with players a heck of a lot more trying to get those resources that you have to contend with them while getting them.
