*CROM!* desperately needs an overhaul!

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166

He already has imo. Basic kind, but still.

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The bulk of the facts I have presented thus far are from the Conan Expanded Conan (EU). However, my friend I feel that you are delving closer to a very murky mindset here
a purist one. I have openly challenged the purist mindset on this thread and I encourage you to read Post no.53 (this post would turn into a wall of text if I copied it all in here). Although feel free too tell me if I have assumed incorrectly here. Just because something is from the Expanded Universe, it does not mean that it is utterly worthless and should not be used. The EU has made some great and truly memorable contributions over time. And many people treat it with what can only be described as open hostility, ranging through to outright hatred. I really do not like the concept of making the various lore sources heirarchial. Funcom has always used material from a variety of Conan sources, not exclusively REH, and this was also the case in Age of Conan. Case in point we now have Yamatai, the Riddle of Steel pack, we can worship bot Mitra and Set, Lemurians are no longer extinct. I could go on and on. This feature, ie-Crom is no different to any other. Crom and Cimmerian religion as a whole are widely regarded as unfinnished topics on Howards part. The sad truth is that at the time of Robert E Howards tragic death, he had only written around 9 sentences about the topic. So the task of fleshing Crom out fell to other authors. Other talent authors and Marvel have poured their hearts and passions into carrying on REHs work and legacy and to dismiss it as garbage just because ‘its not REH’ is ridiculous! Most of the Conan ideas we have come from Marvel, including Crom and were overseen by Stan Lee himself. While I agree that Howards lore is generally at the forefront, I have nothing against using ideas from EU lore. Straight down the line, I like more options. As I always say: “The option which presents more options is usually the better option”.

Yes my friend I feel it is a good idea and is certainly this threads most popular one, and in keeping within the lore. Well there are actually several reasons DethosThePict, but here are a few. The true question is
why not? ALL of the other gods have weapons, armour, shrines, placeables, potions, avatars, etc. Crom players do not have any of those (aside from 2 weapons now), and we a locked out of several Journey Steps, the closest thing we have to a main questline to boot. May I ask you a question Dethos? Im not going to ridicule you I promise, I am just making a comparison. Who is your preferred god in CE? Lets just say Mitra for example sake. If Funcom offered to make an additional weapon set or armour for him you would like that surely
!? I would. What if Funcom said they were going to remove ALL of his features from the game, and he would be nothing more than a reference? That I would not like. Now the same applies to Crom here. The unfortunate reality of the sitauation is that at this point in time the Conan universes most important deity, the god of its central character has no in game role whatsoever beyond the character creation screen. He should have something
ANYTHING beyond being an ‘opt out’ option for the games religion system. I love Crom and am passionate about him, and it pains me to see him so under represented in this game. Ymir and Mitra have statues, Set has banners, Yog has a Skeletal Decoration, so why not let Crom loyalists build something to display their passion and loyalty too. Im not trying to force the specifics of what that should be, that is part of the pupose of this thread (the original post was just starter suggestions). I just want him to have a role befitting his importance in the world of Conan.

Yes my friend I feel it is a good idea and is certainly this threads most popular one, and in keeping within the lore. Well there are actually several reasons DethosThePict, but here are a few. The true question is
why not? ALL of the other gods have weapons, armour, shrines, placeables, potions, avatars, etc. Crom players do not have any of those (aside from 2 weapons now), and we a locked out of several Journey Steps, the closest thing we have to a main questline to boot. May I ask you a question Dethos? Im not going to ridicule you I promise, I am just making a comparison. Who is your preferred god in CE? Lets just say Mitra for example sake. If Funcom offered to make an additional weapon set or armour for him you would like that surely
!? I would. What if Funcom said they were going to remove ALL of his features from the game, and he would be nothing more than a reference? That I would not like. Now the same applies to Crom here. The unfortunate reality of the sitauation is that at this point in time the Conan universes most important deity, the god of its central character has no in game role whatsoever beyond the character creation screen. He should have something
ANYTHING beyond being an ‘opt out’ option for the games religion system. I love Crom and am passionate about him, and it pains me to see him so under represented in this game. Ymir and Mitra have statues, Set has banners, Yog has a Skeletal Decoration, so why not let Crom loyalists build something to display their passion and loyalty too. Im not trying to force the specifics of what that should be, that is part of the pupose of this thread (the original post was just starter suggestions). I just want him to have a role befitting his importance in the world of Conan.

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HAVE YOU SEEN CROM’S LONG LOST IN-GAME FEATURES?

  1. AVATAR:
    Here is an interesting development. Based on an interview with one of Conan Exiles devs Joel Bylos back during the games early development period, it would seem that Crom was originally slated to have his own avatar, which functioned in a manner unique to the others. Crom was to be a defensive avatar who would have the ability to kill enemy avatars. He would do this by striking them with lightning. Perhaps this idea was latter replaced by God Bubbles. Although I can imagine how much a lot of our PvP community like to get a hold of this feature. The Crom avatar has yet to be formally confirmed by a member of Funcom, so for the time being, take it with a pinch of salt. I have reached out to a CM to confirm or deny this information, however all quiet on the reply front thus far. If there are any devs or CMs who can shed further light on this subject, I openly encourage you to post here. But for the time being I will let you all watch and make up your own minds.

That said here is a link to the interview with Joel Bylos (at around the 33:00 minute mark), and some further details of it being discussed in a thread on the forum:

  1. PURGE CREATURE:
    During the first community Mailbag iteration of the Dev Stream, Jens Erik touched upon this unrealised feature. It would seem that there was originally also plans to allow the player to pray to or call upon Crom, which it would (excitingly enough) result in a powerful creature spawning in to attack the player, like a mini Purge of sorts. The details can be found at the 42:40 mark.
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I’m sorry, but I am not seeing much well reasoned argument for why there should be anything changed, or added for Crom, that fits the games aethstetic, mechanics, and deference to Robert E Howard’s Hyborian Age stories. Joel Bylos, and the other developers, most likely deep sixed the Crom avatar idea, as they are fans of REH, and knew it just wouldn’t fit.

As I go through the thread, I am just seeing appeals to make mechanical changes to the game that seem more like classic MMO ‘balancing’ wants, not anything that looks to add to the game’s experience or immersion. I’d actually say the suggestions more so take away from the immersion of a Hyborian Age experience as written by Howard.

As far as

No, that isn’t worth consideration. If we ask why not, we’ll just end up with ad nauseum additions to the game till it just looks like some Second Life in the bronze age.

Or, a mindset that looks at the game and expects it to respect the character and setting it is based on. There is nothing ‘murky’ about that, it is a reasonable expectation to have of a game marketed and developed around a well beloved intellectual property. There is a reason Marvel and other comic book publishers of established properties have had declines of readership, and interest in, the actual comics, and only exist as acquired properties because of the rights to those IPs to churn out movies, shows, merchandise, etc, rather then for the materials they publish now as comics.

Conan Exiles comes, from what I see, ultimately comes down to experiencing the Hyborian Age as written by Robert E. Howard, and interpreted and brought to life by Funcom, its is in its very DNA. To say altering Crom as is fits the lore isn’t a very sound argument. And to say it matters as a game mechanic makes no sense either as the nature of polytheistic practice in the game doesn’t mechanically make it needed as a ‘game balance’ issue either.

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Actually I feel that the argument is extremely well reasoned. And considering how much support the idea of overhauling Crom has now recieved among the Conan Exiles community, I am clearly not the only person who thinks so. I would be more inclined to say that it simply does not appeal to you personally. Which for the record is fine. I knew when I first lauch this campaign back in December 2018 that the idea would not appeal to all players. I understand and respect your viewpoint on the issue.

Ahh
no I am sorry but you could not have been more incorrect in assumption of what I am seeking. I have asked for essentially nothing in the way of mechanics. How is a banner or an ornament a mechanic
!? Or for that matter simple re-skins of existing weapons, which use the same animations
!? The simple fact of the matter is it is not. What I have asked for here is much closer to some roleplay items which I can use to display my allegiance.

Yes and it does just that. Furthermore, any such hypothetical changes would not run counter to that. By this logic the Sword of Crom and newly added Crom’s Hammer are ‘offensive’ to the source material. So is the Yamatai and Riddle of Steel dlc packs disrespectful to the source material too
!? I am sorry but I do not agree with this mindset. If believe they are not then you are adhering to a double standard, and if you believe that they are, then you are operating under a purist mindset (see post no.53; The Purist Mindset). To quote a very wise old sage here named
Multigun:

“Game isn’t and has never ever been advertsied as a game whose lore is only based on the books. Age of Conan was the same way. The comic books were written in the 1970s and are extremely popular, unless you are a so called “purist.” Which means you don’t like anything outside the original books, which means you shouldn’t be even supporting this game at all since it doesn’t take place in the books”.

Moreover, the original story was merely bits and pieces of Conan’s life and world, rather than a full picture. There are definitely things that would have existed in REH’s world that he never got around to writing about. If people really want something which is a pure 100% nothing but Robert E Howard experience, then read the books, as Conan Exiles uses the whole Conan Universe, and does an incredible job of it at that.

This is an out of context and misrepresented fact. The real reason for the decline in comic sales is because much like newspapers and magazines, they are a dying medium. And it is a similar story with CDs and DVDs. Aside from dedicated collectors most people would sooner just read a comic or watch a movie for free online. The Marvel universe is as strong as ever. But I am not here to debate that. Furthermore, there were dozens of talented authors outside of Marvel who wrote great Conan stories.

Im affraid not DethosThePict. This is discussed above; Conan Exiles is the entire Conan universe brought to life, not just Howards.

As stated earlier, its not about ‘balancing’ or new ‘game mechanics’ at all. I dont play PvP, so to me balance is usually just a word which means something is about to get nerfed.

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Do you have specific references to the development team incorporating material from other Conan works like the Marvel comics, Sprague de Camp’s fiction? A statement from them on the matter? I see you keep trying to make the point of this ‘Conan Universe’ idea, but so far see no concrete references to it being Funcom’s intention to incorporate in Conan Exiles at all or finding an example of something where they’ve stated an intention of the game’s vision being beyond the scope of Howard’s writings.

I’m not arguing against them taking artistic licence in parts to fill in gaps of their world building.

But he did write about Crom, and his worship, in very definite terms. And what I see you proposing doesn’t fit that source material.

Not offensive, but not fitting the setting, yes. I think these items didn’t need to be tied to Crom, and are a bad fit as such.

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There is one comic issue in which Crom answers a “prayer”. (although said prayer is pretty much Conan telling Crom to give me a weapon or suck m
) Kind of like in the Arnie movie, where “grant me revenge, if y’aint listening then go to hell”.

I like the Howard stories and I dare say that the 70’s and 80’s comics do respect the lore a lot. They continued on a lot from it, keeping the essence of Conan lore close enough to original lore.

Conan is not a hero, he’s pretty much a jerk, just not as much as just about everyone else in the environment. A product of his times perhaps? His weakness is booze and women. I don’t know of any Conan stories where he’s driven by much else, even as a king or otherwise important, known figure. However, I am also not a savant/ge on the issue.

Crom breathes courage and the will to be a mass murderer in every person as they born, that we know. Won’t argue how epic that is. I’m ok with my choice as Crom deity. My character creation reflects, lightly, my own person as I am a raging cannibal atheist and didn’t want any religion. (did not know picking Crom took away journey steps, wtf?)

But I truly did think that perhaps it would give you at least a measly +1 to strength or grit maybe? I mean
Conan’s stronger than any human being is entitled to be, yeah? But he is also wise and clever. Also does not care what another thinks. I have seen Conan escape from danger and foes if he saw that to be fit at the mo.

I don’t think we need game altering mechanics or anything but I do think we need some way ro honor Crom. Conan talks about Crom a lot, he makes no secret that this God is his chief deity. Why should it be different in the game, if you are a Crom follower, or a Cimmerian? (but Cimmeria does have other gods)

No altar or avatar. Crappy stat boost? We know how important those are. Just new equipment based on Crom lore? Doesn’t have to be best ever. Just some Crom love. Maybe He will be impressed by how arrogant we are to just say my name say my name all over the place.
You can learn all religions anyway, so I don’t see the problem with everyone picking one thing then getting everything else, unlesa rhe devs change things up as to make your religious choice actually matter.

Wirh that said, all hail Yog yo.

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Hey all!
At the generous invitation of Crom’s Faithful,
I’m gonna quote in my post from my thread where i talk about some of the same stuff.
It’s a long one, brace yourselves :wink:

We’ve had some good ideas back and forth in that thread, looking forward to see what the discussion comes forward with in this thread too about this topic :slight_smile:

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174

And this is all I want


Like I said
 a small pointless altar does its job. You can techinally reset feats and pretend your back on Crom


It be nice if it had something
anything.

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As an unapologetic R. E. Howard purist ( I loved ‘Savage Sword of Conan’ growing up, as well as the Arnie movies, but in no way consider them ‘canon’ nor do I the pastiche work, no matter how well-written some of it is), I have to agree with Kendaric and DethosThePict on this one.

However, of course I can absolutely see some of the ‘video game’ style desires for it, and understand that from that viewpoint, Crom makes no sense, and feels hollow choosing him.

The only thing I’d support in the official, unmodified base-game release of CE is for choosers of the Crom Religion to be able to autocomplete the religion journeys, as offered by other players above, because I agree that those journal entries don’t really apply to him in the first place. I’d never support anything further than that in the base game offering for him as I believe it would be entirely out of his context. No swords please, or axes, or stat gains at any level or whatnot
 I’m hoping to play Conan here, not some other game where stuff like this of course makes more sense in the context of gaming. I just don’t agree that it does here, in this IP, in this game, in this genre.

Again, though, I get the video game desires for this, I just personally hope it never comes to the official game so that important parts of the original works that built this entire genre are not mis-identified or changed to suit the game. Hell, if I could mod well, I’d just go make a mod for people that wanted that kinda thing and add in a Crom alter and stuff. I’m sorta surprised someone hasn’t done this already tbh.

Not intended to start a fight with my post, it’s just how I feel. I mean, here I am, a Howard purist, and I finally have a video game that does a very great job (not perfect, but very great) of representing the original fiction work that I adore so much. I’d really hate to lose that. AoC did a great job with it also in my opinion
 and of course both of these games add in far more than the pure Howard lore, and I get why. There just isn’t enough of the original Howard tales to completely flesh out a viable gaming playspace maybe.

But I’d prefer if any pastiche or excess-to-the-lore additions did not go contrary to the original works so that the genre still retains it’s proper identity. Add to it within reason and hopefully in keeping with the intent of the original stories, but please, don’t alter or take away from them or important parts of them in so doing.

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Bronze? Bronze?! BRONZE?! We have STEEL, we use STEEL, we kill with STEEL and we die with STEEL, Crom’s riddle is “The Riddle of STEEL” not “the riddle of bronze” :triumph:

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I’m going to be that guy :stuck_out_tongue:

The Riddle of Steel is something the movie added, it’s not part of the original canon. And yeah, I know Conan Exiles includes several details drawn specifically from the movie, but I just wanted to mention that we don’t have to take it so “seriously” :wink:

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I don’t know too much about book’s lore but I did know this, don’t worry, it was just for the joke because we are in a Crom’s thread :wink:

I know that you don’t know me when you say I’m taking something like that “seriously” :rofl:
I use a lot of IRONy or I’m laughing while answering (of course
you can’t see me) so don’t worry.

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Nah, I deliberately put “seriously” in quotes – I can see that you’re not really taking it seriously :slight_smile:

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I still think that we need some sort of religious upkeepinh requirement. The original idea was also that one clan will worship one god alone and then implement a counter system against specific avatars.

Let the gods be angry and send you and your clan plagues if you don’t worship them enough. Crom has the advantage that he doesn’t demand any attention then.

Also need better human sacrifice systems :slight_smile: the collection of stuff from NPC’s is a bit lame. I would love to drag a thrall or an enemy player to an altar to sacrifice them.

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You could always just give yourself the stipulation of doing it this way, while it may be a good idea to some, others may not entirely enjoy that. it definitely adds more difficulty and length to gather the stuff to upgrade, that’s for sure. Kinda like a Pokemon Nuzlocke, it was made by people to make certain decisions in the game themselves to make it more difficult.

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I disagree, religions require the spending of perk points. Crom requires no perks points
therefore Crom Worshipers have more perk points, that is the advantage of Crom.

While it’s true summoning a big marionette to stomp some rival may be easy, it doesn’t compare to the pure thrill of making a large clan rage quit the server because you “thousand small cuts” them to death solo with no god puppet.

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183

I don’t like roleplaying stuff. It needs to be an actual game mechanic.

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Why not “Land of Crom” ? Climbing giant mountain, top is littered with bones etc. Lightening spawns waves of enemies. Last person/clan standing gets gets crown of sticks and twine that gives no perks. Call it Crom’s smile :innocent:

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this isn’t going to be popular in this thread but,
I like crom just as he is.

I get enough religion nonsense IRL I like the option of nothing.
and you get extra perk points with crom, because you don’t need to spend any on silly temples.