*CROM!* desperately needs an overhaul!

14. Crom Needs An Overhaul
This topic has come up before, and has drawn passionate debate on both sides. However, I am here to argue for a greater role for Crom in Conan Exiles, and am encouraging an open dialogue from players and devs alike on this issue, as it is an important one. As such, this post is long and explorative.

Crom needs something…ANYTHING!! Crom is arguably the most important deity in the Conan universe, and the God of its central figure, Conan himself. A God as cool as Crom needs more. He needs to be better represented in the game, as at this point in time, his only role is essentially an ‘opt-out’ option for the games religion system at the start of the game. I can completely understand the decision for him to have no avatar, and offer no direct aid; that is his nature. I also completely understand and respect the decision by Funcom to take this approach which is friendly to the source material. However, I would argue that Crom can still be included in the game in other ways. So after much head scratching, I have assembled three suggestions as to how he can be overhauled for a rightly deserved, more visible role:

1. The Valor/Fury of Crom:
This would be the most visible and hence the most divisive idea. This would essentially be a berserk or rage mode, in place of an avatar. Think along the lines of rage of the gods from God of War. This would grant the player enhanced damage and resilience for a brief period of time (say 1 min like avatars?). The player would NOT be recieving this power directly from Crom himself. Think of it as an epithany or catharsis. A heightened understanding of Crom and his code, driving the player into a bloodrunk rage/savage frenzied bloodlust. Some would say that this is an unfair advantage, however, an avatar can literally level an entire clans base, months of work, in less than a minute! If anything this is less extreme and unfair. It could utilise ‘manifestations of heightened prowess’ (call it whatever they will) counted from within the player menu as opposed to the shrine. Perhaps even have Croms likeness or silhouette watch approvingly from the sky, not helping, but simply revelling in your savagery and might. How it would be counted is a subject for other debate, and better left to the creative designers at Funcom. Ultimately, my goal here is to argue that something should be implemented; not what specifically.

2. Forge of Crom:
A forge built by the earliest worshippers of Crom who came to the exiled lands in a time long past, now lost to the sands of time. This has been touched upon previously. Has the potential to overlap with number 3. A forge where the player can travel to (preferably atop of one of the highest peaks or near the mounds of the dead in Tundra biome), with recipes on a nearby tablet. Or learn to build it. It would allow players to craft Crom themed weapons and/or armour.

3. Crom themed Weapons (and/or Armour and Decorations):
The most passive and lore friendly, and my personal favourite. These would simply be re-skins of existing weapons. As they are only a cosmetic difference, they would not offer the player any advantage. I would suggest hardened steel due to its Cimmerian nature, or star metal. I visualise these as being more Valhallan or Viking themed, which would be a better fit for the world than the more Japanese themed Yamatai. They could be learned as a religion during the game just as the ‘mountaineer’ religion is learned by the Mountaineer, or the ‘midnight alchemist’ religion from Child of JhebbelSag. It could simply be added to Braga who is already a Crom worshiper, or a new npc, then built at a forge or handcrafted, rather than at a shrine.

Speaking of shrines, I see no reason why he cant have a purely ornamental shrine or even a monument (ie a decorative statue). Just because he doesnt require worship, it does not mean that that it is not permitted or undertaken! Why cant we build a shrine or monument to Crom, even if it is purely decorative/ornamental? Or have banners, seals or busts with the Mountain symbol of his religion? Although hypothetically, if it were functional (eg-through ‘manifestation of heightened prowess’) what material would it use. Hmmm…I say weathered skulls or captured thralls and baby animals for sacriffices (well he is a gloomy and savage God after all!).

My suggestion on how to implement this is also not without controversy. There will always be some fans who wish to see Crom continue to have nothing at all, and I respect that. So I propose that this could be packaged as a DLC as opposed to a free content update. That way those who want Crom to continue having nothing would not have it forced upon them, and those of us who seek to see Crom venerated and better represented can buy it. Personally at this point I would pay ANY asking price to have some Crom themed weapons, armour and decorations. This has the potential, carefully designed, to be the best DLC pack to date.

We have already expanded beyond the canonical. Although Croms religion doesnt provide any benefit, it inspires his followers to create their own benefit; the very essence of a God of self-determination! I like many others want to proudly display my allegiance to my chosen deity at my fortress and in battle; something which followers of all the other Gods already can. And I encourge all others to have their say.

Please Note: I am not arguing specifically for the changes listed here. These are intended as starter suggestions. We all have different perceptions of what features Crom should offer and what they would look like. Think of voting for this as supporting the concept and call for change rather than the specifics. This is a petition, an archive of lore references, and a collection of the communitys suggestions. I also encourage visitors to pay attention to my posts which are headed with boldface and capitalised, as they contain lore referenced facts.

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What if there was a sword you had to craft From just steel. But here is the catch, Crom is about you doing things yourself.

You would craft the great sword in smelters (t4 smelter needed).

Then that sword has a timer before it defaults to a normal steel sword. lets say 1 minute.
Before that timer runs out you must take it to the black smiths and craft it to the next level (flawless) with more steel.
there is another 1 minute timer and you must dip it in water and craft a perfected from it.
After cooling it, another minute timer and you must take it to the smelter sto reheat, another minute time and then back to the black smiths table (t4 blacksmit needed, any) for more steel and cool it once more to created a perfected flawless Sword of Crom, 85 DMG and 30% armor pen, and very heavy, but also durable. Cannot be modified or repaired, but can have the handle dyed. Make the steel cost exteme, and the craft times at the stations be 30 minutes. If you want to make this sword, it will take a minimum of 2 hours. You must work for Croms gifts.

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Crom does not answer prayers. The strength you get from your struggles and perseverance are Croms gift to you.

You’re welcome lol

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Dude, no

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Im into the idea of being able to craft a special sword if you pick croms religion. The steel sword conans dad carries in thefirst conan movie would be great for it too.

Or maybe you get 1 extra attribute level in strength. That would be cool and subtle. And it goes away forever if you learn another religion.

But i like it the way it is.

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Yeah the sword would be more in line if you made a b…h to craft and use only steel for the blade. Crom gives nothing, but rewards extreme effort.

CROM IS NOT ACTUALLY ANSWERING A PRAYER IF YOU BUILD IT YOURSELF IN THE HAND CRAFTING MENU

or in your blacksmiths bench. We are NOT advocating that Crom answer prayers or lend aid to the player. What we are asking for, is that the player be allowed to handcraft some weapons or ornamentals so that they can proudly display their allegiance to him, especially when going into battle. So therefore, he is not actually helping or intervening, if we build these items ouselves in either the Handcrafting Menu or Forge. Just as say if I built a sword or table in my tool shed, it would be me creating it not Crom. This is very different to say food appearing in a bowl (Ambrosia) at a Mitra shrine or transforming branches into an arrow made from a snake (Snake Arrows) at a Set shrine. Those are the acts of a deity and worship which require a religious shrine to build. These however would be something which the players in game character is building with his own two hands, to pay tribute to Crom, not something gifted by Crom himself.

For the record: I am not advocating at any point in this thread that Crom offer direct help.

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Crom does not answer your prayers

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Thankyou for your input, and I feel you understand where I am trying to go with this. Weaponry is a great idea, as Crom would not be building it; your character is, with his own two hands and labor. Similarly, if I created a sculpture or tappestry of the symbol below with a hammer and chisel, or sewed it myself with a needle and thread, it is my own work, not something Crom gifted to me. No different than if I sprayed it on my lounge room wall with spray paint. I did it, not Crom. :slight_smile:

220px-Crom

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Even though you dont agree, I respect your viewpoint and appreciate your reply. I am acutely aware that this idea would not be for everyone. And believe me, I did not take the decision to start this topic lightly! I agonised over it for the longest time.

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Yeah guys I would be super happy with even a weapon or weapons. Or a passive strength bonus. His fathers sword, which I think was called the Draconian (please correct me if Im wrong) would be cool. And Valericas Valkyrie armor which she saves him in at the battle of the mounds.

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When times are good, Crom has given you his blessings. When times are hard, Crom has allowed this to happen so that you may grow through adversity. So also blessings. Sometimes you get blessed by Crom really, really hard. Truly the most wondrous of gods.

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(From September post) The forge is the shrine of the Cimmerians. The belief in Crom makes them stronger itself. I agree that Crom doesn’t listen. Howard was all about "that which does not kill you makes you stronger. " The belief makes the Cimmerians stronger, like hammering, heating and iceing steel at the forge. Performing dangerous tasks for the Teacher of Crom (a task in the deep desert and one on the coldest mountain) would give players + strength, + grit, + survival.

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He certainly does not answer my payers, nor would I want him to (stated with politeness). For the record, that is NOT what I am advocating here. The weapons, armour and decorations would be built in the hand crafting menu or the blacksmiths bench by the player character (and maybe his thralls), not by a God or at his shrine. It would in no way whatsoever come from Crom! It would just be emblazoned with his style/insignia or whatever the case may be, as a way of paying homage and displaying my allegiance to him. Much in the same way I would build signs and banners to pay homage and show allegiance to my team at a football game.

Thankyou for your support on this one Timstah, and for having the courage to go against the grain on this contentious issue. Even the act of reading about the forge was enthralling for me, and a cool idea too. Crom can be more noticeable in this game without simply being a towering monstrosity which smashes down buildings.

EDIT: for any who would like to read the discussion, here is the link to Timstah’s original suggestion:
https://forums.funcom.com/t/mountain-top-forge-teaches-crom/37635

Hmm. :thinking: Not 100% sure if I know what the point you are trying to make is, but ill take a stab at it. Unfortunately Im going to have to disagree on this one Robarbarian. This essentially argues that Crom has a role in our fortunes. He does does not create the situations/circumstances, he only created our coping/adaptation mechanism. WE cope (strive/overcome) through our actions. As Robert E. Howard stated: little does he care if men live or die. His sole gift to men is at the time of their birth, where he gives them will and courage, and the ability to slay and survive. But he doesnt give people blessings or adversity, they are independent of him, and giving good or bad fortune either way would be lending them aid; he only gave us the strength to deal with them. Crom is all about self-determination. He gave us the drive and tenacity to succeed, but the rest we must do and solve ourselves. But you are certainly right about how wonderous he is with his teaching methods! Experience is the best teacher.

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Crom doesn’t answer your post :wink:

Well, it is clearly stated that Crom doesn’t care to be worshiped and is even feared to attract his attention. Furthermore it is said, that while every Cimmerian is a follower of Crom, there is no priest of him. Thus it would violate the lore to do any deeds or building regarding Crom. The closest thing I can imagine is your first suggestion. But even then, giving someone an advantage by just selecting the religion would be unfair to others, since you have to build altars and gather resources to utilize their benefits.

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I am first and foremost a Howard fan, and i applaud Funcoms decision to stick so closely to the Conan lore in making this game. They have recreated a Hyborian story here; and done a great job of it.

Maling Crom into a gameified mechanic eould fly in the face of all that. Crom is perfect as he is. Remember…

“It was useless to call on Crom, because he was a gloomy, savage god, and he hated weaklings. But he gave a man courage at birth, and the will and might to kill his enemies, which, in the Cimmerian’s mind, was all any god should be expected to do.”

Besides, Crom already has an avatar. Conan. Conan cuts you down and gives you a chance to live or die on ypur own merits.

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It was a joke and not intended to be lore-accurate. It was less about Crom and more a criticism of certain religious dogma IRL. The point I was failing to make is the ludicrousness of crediting the concept of God for all of existence and everything good, while absolving it of any responsibility for anything bad and passing the blame onto the victims of the cosmic creation, including the concept of the devil (even accounting for the supposition of free will). Oh, and be grateful for the loss of your legs, you’ll be a better person for the experience!

Crom seems more reasonable by comparison, at least he’s honest. Though such irresponsibility is hardly deserving of worship if you ask me. Not that Crom would care. He’s like a father who teaches his kids basic motor-coordination (that nature somehow didn’t imbue them with) then idly watches them playing in traffic. Truly barbarous. All hail Crom!

If Crom was in the game…IF Crom was in the game, the player should have 1 of 3 random events happen

  1. Crom does nothing.
    whatever is being crafted breaks and disapears, whether its a religous armor/weopon, or specialtyitem related to Crom.

  2. Crom is angered
    Any priests under the players ownership immediatly dies, anything around the religous temple, owned by the player is destroyed

  3. Crom is pleased
    “Blessing of Crom” buffs the player for 12 hours, increasing health and vitality

Summoning:

same as above, however if he’s anger, becomes an NPC and begins to imediatly destroy everything.

THAT would cover Crom. It’s better not to pray to him. chances are he will be angered, or do nothing at all

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