End game PvE gear is better for the purpose of PvPing then end game PvP gear.
In MY opinion this should not be the case. People should (in my opinion) not be forced to do PvE to be competative in PvP (as PvP gear should not be better then PvE gear for the purpose of PvE )
I believe Funcom also has the same intentions, otherwise they would not have invented stats like PvP Armor and -pvp hit rating.
The only issue is, the balancing was not done properly resulting in the issues described above.
To be fair there’s like only 3 cases where the pvp weapons are much worse than the t5 equivalent (the others would be bow/xbow and sin dagger).
But even in the case of the 1H weapons that you linked, even if you gave the t5 -pvp stats, the t4 would still be miles better than the pvp one, so that would still not make the pvp one any better.
I mean the benefits to begin with probably won’t change the course of a battle - strong teamwork trumps most stat boosts. For pvp, I think raidfinder rings (and on sin, t6) are the only real piece of equipment that has enough stats that it can and will change the course of any battle. The weapons surely buff dps, but at the end of the day I think it’s pretty obvious good focus is far more important than a weapon having 6 more base dps.
I guess for duels it’s a different story, but most dueling matchups are pretty lame to begin with
That said, I wish the system chiefqueef described was in place . Characters without AA really get crapped on by everything.
I think the best analogy here would be if in order for every pve character out there to attain the best PVE weapons, they had to beat the african boat squad premade team for a chance for it to drop.
The t5 barb 2h axe is sick though (and sogoth is obviously great too but in a different way ).
But yes I myself don’t care too much about t5 weapons simply because everyone has access to t4 which is literally “free” nowadays (between RF and how easy t4 pugs are) and the difference is generally minuscule. I’d care a bit more if I still played (zerker) barb at all and maybe go through the effort of raiding t5 a bit then. Of course Fury doesn’t even have RF anymore but that’s another matter entirely… There should really not be 2 servers anymore by now, just optional pvp playfields (similar to epic ones) for outdoor zones on Crom.
Now, I still agree with 100% of what chiefqueef said above, don’t get me wrong. I don’t want gear to matter too much in pvp - if at all. Never have, never will. But many mmo players enjoy some amount of “power progression” in pvp, so a compromise has to be found somewhere.
But the fact is, full pvp 10 gear is competitive and absolutely fine for high end pvp. If you have that, stop worrying about pve gear and just play the damn game*. T4/5 and t3 craft weapon should really be the least of your worries. They don’t magically make you kill people 10 times faster or anything like that. They don’t land combos for you. It’s like that vid that was posted in the past of a t6 vs pvp 10 sin saying “muh look at the difference the gear makes!!” when the pvp 10 sin was not landing any combos and the t6 one hit every single one of them.
*RF and chaos rings are broken for pvp and make it much harder to enter pvp than it should be though, the pvp 6 protection rings are okay (but too low armour) but really way too far behind once you account for gems. Tanks remain perfectly playable with just those pvp rings but on other classes the difference is way too large.
And t6 on sins is dumb because of how the class works (insane and very quick burst + magic immunity on a short cooldown) so even tanks can be blown up in a few seconds. And since FC did put -pvp stats on t6 gear, this was obviously NOT intended. It doesn’t work the same on other classes because they are noticeably easier to kill when running t6 gear so there is an actual trade off for them.
They just don’t seem to understand the value of the different stats in their game very well, for example they put -combat rating on some things - but while the numbers “look” big (say -1000 cr), it’s actually NOTHING in practice because it’s such a weak stat that scales very very poorly. Magic damage scales far better but they put such a high amount of spell and armour penetration on t6 gear that it ends up not making any difference either.
Also I have bad news, ferocity works in pvp. And a bit of -hit rating should not be difficult to work around on casters. No glancing hits…
I’m really scared that if DT can put mroe ferocity gems into weapons, it’d completely break the class
Imagine if every life leech was a dooming presence
Yes DT with ferocity has the potential to completely break pvp (I guess pve too but isn’t that already done?). But -500 hit rating on a melee is quite a lot. I just checked on mine and I’d have to play with pressing + precise to keep something like 7% hit rating. That’s a lot of hits that will “glance” or miss on dexterity users. I guess you still get procs from glancing hits but at least you’d get a lot less crits and a lot weaker life taps. Also since that’s only 1 kutche weapon it’s “only” 100 ferocity + whatever gems and buffs you can get. But I’m not sure if that’s much consolation and I don’t have a weapon to test it either, ferocity should just NOT WORK on players, period.
I have tried the t6 polearm on my guard in pvp with the absolute highest hit rating you can have (and guard gets a good amount from feats remember), I can tell you for a fact -1000 hit rating was far too much. The glancing blows and dodges/parries made it really bad.
Since DT relies on procs it’s a different beast though, you can kill people with a candlestick or a frying pan and I don’t mean as vanity…
Ferocity on DT is pretty garbage except for Dooming Presence. The 1h range is so tiny that even 334 ferocity which would give 50% range doesn’t rly matter
Not sure I agree with this, that would give life leech/mystical bane 2h range (from 2m to 3m!). considering the main weakness of DT in pvp is how easy it is to cc lock and kite, adding 50% more range seems pretty strong to me.
Imagine if DT had the same range as upheaval, crush armor, feint attack, etc. Way harder to kite, and way easier to land combos. Just comes down to how much that -hit rating effects dt.
Life Leech and Asfof are not even affected by ferocity at all. I don’t think you can reach 50% in pvp considering you would need a ferocity potion. From what I’ve tested, -hit rating on melees is a big deal, especially if people run a little bit of evade chance like rangers. You won’t hit them.
I think it’s a much bigger deal on casters, especially demo, because it’s pretty broken on wof and all their other aoes that become giant.
The fact that people(most) arent complaining about strength of t5,but impossibilty to get it through raid finder is also important. If you cant focus for 4min fight(t5 2nd boss which drops weapons) - why do you even play MMORPG
This is besides the point. I dont want to need to spend my precious time to PvE to have the best available gear for PvP.
As stated before. Funcom has introduced PvP specific stats to accommodate this. The only point the topic starter is trying to make is that the PvP specific stats are too low for some of the PvE gears/weapons, causing imbalance.
Getting 100 ferocity gives an extra 0.3m range on 1h weapons. So a DT with both the tali/shield and the weapon would go from 2m to 2.6m. But the -pvp hit would be horrible. Overall ferocity isn’t that good even in onslaught for melees. Casters on the other hand get a huge benefit from it, not sure if it’s worth using it in pvp though.
topic starter only mentioned t5 being fine with t4, but as stated above t4 isnt worse than t5, so why would he be fine with t4? because he can get it via raid finder. thats it And why no1 is asking to add -1kk hit rating on rf prot rings? just because all of you got if from raid finder through the years,but it is same PvE as t5 and those rings shouldnt be better than PvP ones
So in short you want everybody who is not pvp10 to play at a disadvantage
And the only imbalance t6 adds to sin is that it makes it weaker than if he was using pvp gear.
Yes, you understand me correctly.
Just to make the discussion less black and white: PvE gear should be useable in PvP, just as it’s possible to use PvP gear in PvE.
. Characters without AA really get crapped on by everything.
