Sorry, no offense meant! I should finish my first coffee before visiting the forums.^^
But you have no hyper armor at all when using the short sword.
So every long sword heavy dash will interrupt you and force you to roll (or tank).
What that person showed in the video should not be in this game PERIOD. The other player had no chance to defend themselves of flee. That is cheating in my opinion. All animation cancelling needs to be removed, PERIOD. If you commence an attack you need to live with it. Just like in the real world. You think Conan the barbarian is gunna cancel his sword swings? Give me a break
Cool. Then make an animation and button press for feints. You cant feint when youve already made a commited swing
We already have a keybind for that (default X → Wield/Unwield). The issue with stamina usage is, that some attacks only drain stamina when the game code says “now your weapon does damage”. Not every frame of an attack animation does damage. If attacks would drain stamina as soon as the animation starts (in other words as soon as you hit the button) then animation canceling would be more balanced.
The normal 2h animation canceling is not a problem in the game. The big problem is the offhand animation canceling, because it is way too fast and abusable with macros.
But Funcom went the usual “overnerf” way. I don’t mind the changes. We will see how this new combat system plays out. (I am tipping on either Poke & Roll with spear or Slash & Roll with 2h Hammer)
Today’s patch should address the 1h spam with offhand. There are still a few instances of animation cancel which are still working but they aren’t really problematic in my opinion. I am not a big fan of the fact that you can’t unequip mid animation but rolling it is.
Stamina cost AND some animation. What Chaoruk linked is valid, but weapons shouldn’t just disappear in your pockets if you made a mistake. Mistakes have consequences. It costs you an arm and a leg?
Good. Yog approves it. It makes its followers’s stomach full.
@Narelle rolling has an animation while unequipping your gear doesn’t. It makes more sense than doing some “whacky magic” to make your weapons disappear faster than light.
It is my interpretation of sorcery and not everything has to be so realistic in a video game. It is about having fun and when things become too real they stop being fun.
*Croc about to eat my ■■■
Ayy let me finish my cool blood flicking animation.
(yes, I know I can roll…still clunky)
i played live test today.
They reverted the bow/arrow changes ahhahha
you can 2~4 shots anyone. using khari bow + obsidian arrow or red mother + hollow arrow.
Horses will still be the meta.
So in the end it stays the same, but bows are the strongest weapon on ground, spear is A grade and hammer is maybe B grade.
It actually removes skill. Since in essence all 1h had same animation time with the trick. Part of combat is risk reward. Thus now they can better see where iframes, Stam usage, dmg, reach, animation time can be tweaked to give each weapon its own risk reward for different fighting styles.
If all these cancelations were done without any 3rd part program, it would be pure skillplay.
But even with macros, you need to be be very agile, know how to move around the battlefield and a lot of things.
The current changes are lame.
Maybe you didn’t play test live yet, but i can solo 2 good veteran fighters with my bow.
I was fighting with just 10 grit to test hahahahaha.
One of these two players i mentioned was a spear god when the meta was spear+roll (2018).
Anyway, horses are still the bosses. Don’t worry. If you are a pve player, you are going to feel the difference when face some npcs… You Will get locked into an animation for a long time. Even Dodge rolls can’t interrupt animation at some frames.
Dear Funcom,
I have been maining a 2h sword for about… 3 years. My whole deal with Conan is I like to fight the giant bosses solo without cheesing the boss or getting help from pets/thralls. I’ve been getting into pvp little by little and am not too shabby at it. But big bosses and big swords are what I know and love best.
Now, animation canceling by un-wielding is pretty much required for you to be able to make the 2h sword viable. Not weapon-switching, but un-wielding and wielding again. There was roughly a 1 second delay that prevented you from being able to swing the weapon, but that was an acceptable and fair price to pay for being able to move again, because cancelation freed you from being stuck.
That 1 second delay meant you couldn’t spam-attack by this method, either, so that was good too. (sadly, it seems like some people found a way to get around this with offhand weapon-switching, so the rest of us have to bite the bullet.)
Now, you could learn and use many other tricks, learn to chain the right combos, master the use of the downward chop (mainly only good for pvp or ending non-boss mobs quickly) but at the end of the day, that weapon depended on canceling to grant it much needed mobility.
The reason for that is the long delay between when your attack ends, and when you actually move again. Somewhere between 1 second and 2 seconds. All the attacks are this way, except for the last hit of the heavy attack, which is fast for some reason when, really, THAT should be the slowest one.
And I notice this bizarre and backward timing issue on other weapons, too. The first heavy attack on a spear is faster and has a shorter recovery than the light attack, second heavy of the hammer is faster than the first light, etc. These aren’t the weapons I know best, so I’ll refrain from citing any examples… except for the hammer, as a comparison.
So here’s some quick benchmarks:
Time it takes to do 1 light or heavy attack and be able to move again: 2 seconds.
Time it takes to do the fastest possible combo (light-heavy-light-heavy) and move again: 4 seconds.
Now, let me put this in perspective:
The HAMMER’s light attack, that big hunk of metal, is about 1.75 seconds. It’s somehow faster than the 2h sword.
What I can tell you is that with the removal of animation canceling, it is very hard to be maneuverable in PvE, especially against bosses. Even with the best optimized build I can put together, the duration of the fights can sometimes extend well into the half-hour to 1 hour range because now there is less room to maneuver, less time between the boss’s attacks to land hits or arrange a counter-attack, etc, because I’m either stuck in place trying to conserve stamina while my character does nothing except pose after he has STOPPED MOVING… or, I roll, and lose a ton of stamina, and I have to wait.
I can now only rely on sprint attacks for hit and runs. Sprint attacks resolve in about 1.25 to 1.3 seconds, and unlike the other attacks, you can actually move soon after your weapon stops moving.
Using this, you can only safely get one hit on a boss. If you use a normal attack, then you’re back to needing to wait a long time to recover. You also need to use up a lot of stamina and build up a run about 3 seconds in advance. You can’t slip a quick light attack in every 1 or 2 seconds by being maneuverable. Hit and runs are not very viable anymore.
For PVP, there’s the totally separate but also very important issue of how much time there is between when the attack ends and when you can actually move. This is the period where you are strictly vulnerable to counter-attacks with no offense of your own to discourage enemies. Again, it’s weirdly slow for no real reason. Your only choice is to attack again and eat more stamina to try to keep people from coming at you, roll to get away fast (but eat up a lot of stamina) or wait it out and hope you got lucky.
In conclusion:
Funcom, if you are going to take away the only means to make a weapon viable, I would like you to actually balance the timings of the weapon as well. Specifically, adjust its earliest attacks so that their recovery period matches their effort: aka, light attacks and earlier attacks recover faster, heavy attacks and later attacks recover slower. Also, please just reduce the vulnerable period for the earlier attacks.
You can leave a slow recovery as the combo continues so that the only way out after you commit is a roll, but 1 or 2 attacks should be less committal. 1 attack should be totally non-committal… and it should not require building up a sprint attack just to have that single non-committal attack…
Doing so will encourage mobility and maneuvering quickly at the start of a fight and turn your focus and decision-making on when to begin the engagement, when to back off and re-adjust, and when to commit, and it will leave the dodge roll in the position it’s meant to be in: an emergency escape when all else has failed.
As a closing note, let me read the in-game description of the great sword:
“Great swords are faster than many other two-handed weapons, and their great reach makes them ideal for fending off groups of opponents.”
That reach thing is only sometimes true. The claim of being fast used to always be true, but now it’s just a joke.
Funcom, please fix. Thank you.
I’m just going to hat tip in your direction for the well done feedback (regardless of anyone’s personal opinion about it). You obviously put a ton of thought and effort into it, well done.
Thank you.
Since the post got noticed, I wanted to add some commentary on how animation canceling could have anything to do with skill.
“Pressing a button twice” involves little skill, true, but building the habit and learning when to use the technique does involve skill. The technique itself enabled additional decision-making, taking away your ability to attack but allowing you to run away, reposition, or try something else entirely different like maybe use an animation-based consumable. It emphasized mobility, positioning and quick thinking, all of which have a vast skill ceiling. Ultimately, the combat now feels like it has been reduced to a slow game of timing combos, timing dodges, and walking in circles until your stamina is back.
This might be good for PVP, but for PVE, especially my kind of solo and engaged PVE, it’s just painful to go through.
Now, I agree with anyone who says that canceling as a way to jump between weapons and chain endless uninterrupted attacks with zero drawbacks is pure cheese, because it is and I shouldn’t have to explain why. That’s not what I’m defending.
What I’m defending is an emphasis on the usefulness of mobility, positioning and quick decision-making that came with canceling. What I’m attacking is the often unnecessary slowness and built-in delays of many weapons, delays that extend well past their actual animations, or sometimes contextually just don’t make sense.
I do hope someone from Funcom reads these posts and recognizes that something good actually has been lost and they need to do more to patch the hole it has left.
I have to spam a post without any information just to say, that
this is great feedback.
Welcome to the forums!
Just saw this. Was not aware that this was a thing, because my weapon has always drained stamina on every attempted attack, so… not a damn clue what you’re talking about.
For reference, I main the 2h sword, but I’ve been learning the 1h sword, and it drained stamina like normal on an animation cancel, too.
Animation cancelling is a very good mechanic and more for a slow game like Conan. It bring the game to another level. As a vsfighting player, you can use it for trap and brain your opponent. I agree with the 2h sword. Animation cancelling is needed for this weapon combined with ctrl and some intuition and anticipation and luck too. Its sad too hear that this mechanic was not intend to be in the game. Fighting will have no more fun now and will no longer require skill… It will be a slow ■■■ combat system game with nothing interesting as a pvp. But let’s see maybe funcom have a good reason and prepare to us some new combat mechanic who will bring the game better than ever. I’ll just add another thing, sometime the hazard do well the things. Edit: Concerning archery iam sorry but, until you throw away the ricochet mechanic it will be ■■■■. Your foe can have a shield, it is not a problem because with your bow you can simply hit in there foot and if they crouch with there shield just run near them and throw arrow in his head. Archery is more op close to you opponent then from a long distance. So what the point killing your opponent with 2 3 4 5 or 6 shot? It will be the same because a good archer can just play with you like a cat do with a mouse because of the ricochet shield or not. Plus the shield was not that broken why nerf? It’ s one of the thing the most useless in the game… And in pvp the skill require to pass a shield before was good enought for having fun, but hey we can’t anymore (from the two side i precise. Being the one with a 2hsword a katana or a 2hmace and the one who need to block with the shield because it require skill from the two side and if the guy with the shield have no skill he can just roll the timing is so easy for these weapon to escape…) I really op funcom prepare some good fighting mechanic for the future. Because if it’s require no skills there’s no pleasure.
Skilled gamer where? I just see a guy abusing of some weapons animations and possibly scripting.
Spamming axe jump animation + spear first hit animation the whole time… Where is the fun or the excitement in fights like those? Besides that way of fighting does not look natural or smooth, looks clunky.
You just complain about a thing you can do too plus there is something universal in this game called roll. It’s easy to do and with a good timing your spamming axe jump phobie desapear. I don’t want to be hard with you maybe you don’t have many experience in game in general but don’t forget that this game is slow, the mechanic are poor because of that i remember having suggest mini-game and Qte for the game. Could be fantastic for rp serveur. Maybe for you a battle without skill is enought in a game. But for me not. Look natural or not its not something important in a videogame. But animation cancelling can be compare to fighting skill. Like trap, brain, keep your ennemy to a certain distance (2hsword is the first example who come in mind) etc etc its a pure fighting skill mechanic. Plus iam mad because you just say fighting game are for guy abusing. Oh wait it is true. We love abusing we continu until our opponent learn to respond the mechanic and get some skill and finish to get better too. Oh wait no animation cancelling anymore mean i can’t have multiple technique with the Katana in rp. Adieu,
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Perilus Dominum, Mitraeum Papam!!
-Hiten Mitsurugi! Onishishi Shishigiri!
-Hiten Mitsubishi! Kodak!” Rip